Sign in to follow this  
prometheus59650

Episode 1.10 “Despite Yourself” Discussion Thread

Recommended Posts

1 hour ago, prometheus59650 said:

Bring on Goatee Lorca. :)

I bet the episode revolves around Riker dealing with The Pegasus situation on a Holodeck, by reliving key moments of previous Sterfleet crews so that he can tell Picard the truth, despite not actually doing so in the original episode.

That or it'll be all about goatee Riker.

Oh wait, they did that...

Well, let's do that episode again: Trek's sloppy seconds would be refreshing, right?

Right?

giphy-downsized.gif.bc387b1e5277901eb30aee8d368e17db.gif

Edited by Tupperfan

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, prometheus59650 said:

Bring on Goatee Lorca. :)

Or... real prime universe (?).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
54 minutes ago, Sehlat Vie said:

Or... real prime universe (?).

That's what I'm thinking.

We shall see.

 

Anticipation level for this episode is surprisingly high.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
47 minutes ago, prometheus59650 said:

That's what I'm thinking.

We shall see.

 

Anticipation level for this episode is surprisingly high.

Hey...it’s Star Trek.   That other reason the internet was invented.  :P

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
38 minutes ago, Sehlat Vie said:

Hey...it’s Star Trek.   That other reason the internet was invented.  :P

Trek and cat videos?

There are lots of cat videos.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, prometheus59650 said:

Trek and cat videos?

There are lots of cat videos.

Yeah... um, that’s right.  Cat videos.  :angel_not: :giggle:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, Enterprise Discovery said:

Maybe the Discovery jumped into the future, now taking place after Star Trek Nemesis and the mind meld future scene of Star Trek.

I kinda doubt it, but anything’s possible...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ummm...wow.

That was something else. Dark, in the extreme, from Culber to the Agony Room. Making it a room is a simple change, but it honestly ramps up the horror factor quite a bit. The camp atmosphere of all the previous MU episodes is all gone here and it is to great effect. It's a scary place and the "fun" of visiting is gone.

I have no idea how this is going to comes out, but I was firmly gripped for the hour.

All that said....oh.....my, how I like myself some Captain Killy.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We learned that the fan theories about Tyler being Voq are more than likely true, although Tyler does not say the name so we aren't 100% sure. He could be some other Klingon, but Voq makes the most sense.

Once again the Tilly as captain idea gets trotted out. I don't know, I just don't see it at all.

One has to wonder what mirror Discovery is up to in the 'prime' universe. If mirror Discovery has spore drive, then Starfleet has its hands full. Once they figure out where they are, they will probably try to launch a coup attempt and take over the Federation.

A shocking death for Dr Culber, although I doubt that will be the last we see of him. He probably should have discretely asked for back-up when he was processing the examination results. It kind of bugs me that no alarm goes off. Shouldn't the computer be able to detect his life signs failing? Tyler makes it off the ship and no one notices that the doctor is dead in the time it takes him to get to the transporter room? I guess that sometimes the future tech needs to have a loophole to let the plot work. 

Mutineer Burnham will fit in finely in this new universe. The slow clap when she exits the turbolift was darkly hilarious.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Hammer said:

Once again the Tilly as captain idea gets trotted out. I don't know, I just don't see it at all.

I actually saw it very quickly. Sure she's quirky, but she's intelligent, clever, curious and has an affinity for her crewmates.

 

Shrug. I see it anyway.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I feel I haven't posted much of my thoughts on Discovery, as I've kinda been busy what with a baby and work and all...but I have been enjoying it for the most part.  And this new episode kind of solidified it a bit for me.  It was a good start for this "Chapter Two" as they are billing it.  I was in.  I liked the reveal of where they are, I liked the new interpretation of where they are...and I felt that the characters all had a lot of intriguing stuff going on...the kind of stuff that makes me wanna keep watching.  It isn't the same as the Trek of old...but there are all these hints that just make me feel like...yeah...this is Trek. A new kind of Trek...but Trek. The concept of the Spore Drive and the ramifications of what makes it actually work...I like the moral dilemma it has, and I assume, will continue to have with Stamets.

I'm excited to see how things progress in the mirror universe...and I hope that when they get out of it, maybe we still get that trick reveal that they end up in the REAL prime universe. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, prometheus59650 said:

I actually saw it very quickly. Sure she's quirky, but she's intelligent, clever, curious and has an affinity for her crewmates.

 

Shrug. I see it anyway.

I think she's too indecisive and lacks confidence at this point. She has qualities that would make her a good science officer but she would really need to do some growing as a character before I'd see her as command material. If she was thrown in the chair right now, I think she would trip up because she would be trying to please everyone.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Hammer said:

We learned that the fan theories about Tyler being Voq are more than likely true, although Tyler does not say the name so we aren't 100% sure. He could be some other Klingon, but Voq makes the most sense.

Once again the Tilly as captain idea gets trotted out. I don't know, I just don't see it at all.

One has to wonder what mirror Discovery is up to in the 'prime' universe. If mirror Discovery has spore drive, then Starfleet has its hands full. Once they figure out where they are, they will probably try to launch a coup attempt and take over the Federation.

A shocking death for Dr Culber, although I doubt that will be the last we see of him. He probably should have discretely asked for back-up when he was processing the examination results. It kind of bugs me that no alarm goes off. Shouldn't the computer be able to detect his life signs failing? Tyler makes it off the ship and no one notices that the doctor is dead in the time it takes him to get to the transporter room? I guess that sometimes the future tech needs to have a loophole to let the plot work. 

Mutineer Burnham will fit in finely in this new universe. The slow clap when she exits the turbolift was darkly hilarious.

I found the slow clap to be chilling. The bridge crew took such glee in seeing someone killed. They approved of the violence. 

I always thought that Tilly was just too young yet. She's the type that if she is thrown into a life and death situation she either rises to the occasion or fails badly. She has the brains. She could potentially be captain in a few years given a good mentor. It could get really interesting for her. I can see her placed in a place where she has to make a decision as captain where there are no good choices. Captain Killy may face her Kobayashi Maru test in real life. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, scenario said:

I found the slow clap to be chilling. The bridge crew took such glee in seeing someone killed. They approved of the violence. 

I always thought that Tilly was just too young yet. She's the type that if she is thrown into a life and death situation she either rises to the occasion or fails badly. She has the brains. She could potentially be captain in a few years given a good mentor. It could get really interesting for her. I can see her placed in a place where she has to make a decision as captain where there are no good choices. Captain Killy may face her Kobayashi Maru test in real life. 

I just found it to be a reflection of how they despised him. He eluded to his difficulties in getting their respect before he attacked Burnham.

In this episode, we learn that Mirror Lorca is wanted for killing Mirror Burnham. What if Mirror Lorca escaped to the prime universe and took prime Lorca's spot? It could explain his apparent desire to get there and not go back. It would also explain why he targeted prime Burnham for his crew. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Really liked this one. 

This was the one where things felt like they really started to click.    

Jonathan Frakes brought a noticeable bump in vigor to the whole show; it felt (forgive the pun) energized

Wrote about it last night on my blog.

*****LOTS OF SPOILERS!****

https://musingsofamiddleagedgeek.blog/2018/01/07/star-trek-discovery-s1-10-despite-yourself/

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Okay, I'm gonna rant first, then I'm gonna say how much I liked the rest of the episode.

SPOILERS

 

SPOILERS

 

SPOILERS

As a gay man, this episode infuriated me. Killing off Culber is the same old tired "kill your gays because they're icky" trope we see so much of. Yes, I know, the showrunners have said this isn't the end of Culber's story, and they will retcon this one way or another. But that doesn't matter, what's done is done. They used the "kill your gays" trope, and what's worse, they used it DESPITE knowing that it existed. Trek has a terrible history with LGBT characters (meaning: We're either not there or we're twisted Mirror Universe versions of "the good and nice straight characters"), and the fact that they resorted to this trope now REALLY REALLY REALLY doesn't help ANYTHING. I get it that this might be a trivial issue for non-minority folks, but for us this is a big deal, especially since the show went out of its way to tell us "you're part of Trek's future now". But hey, the first chance of using the "kill your gays" trope and they jump at it. And a certain group of Trek "fans" applauds, of course - "so glad they killed off one of the gays", "now I can finally watch this show with my kids", "Finally, Star Trek is back to being the Star Trek I know and love", etc. Well done, writers. Really, really smart move. Not.

Anyways.

The rest of the episode? I loved. I wish they had set this show in the Mirror Universe from the beginning. It makes so much more sense and everyone fits in so nicely. Especially Lorca, of course, but then, he fits in because... well, we all know why by now I guess.

I'll jump over to the Lorca topic for the next things I have to say because honestly HE WAS SO GOOD IN THIS EPISODE. LEATHER LORCA *hnnnnggggg*

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, Hammer said:

I think she's too indecisive and lacks confidence at this point.

Well, at this point, I've already seen moments where she can turn off that indecision, make a call and be assertive about it.

That said, she IS only CADET Tilly at this point, so, of course she has to mature.

 

Getting a crash course in that this week though, no doubt.

8 hours ago, scenario said:

Captain Killy may face her Kobayashi Maru test in real life. 

Seems to be what they're setting her up for.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have watched this great episode twice now.  Here are my bullet points.

 

- "The emperor laid waste to your ship in retaliation.....it is believed you escaped."  Yes.....he escaped to their universe and he is putting on an act. We have seen evidence of this before. Especially when he input the override command that got them to the mirror universe in the first place.  Question is, what is Lorca's mission?

- Anyone catch the quite obvious Star Trek: The Motion Picture music ques? 

- Captain Tillly is hot as hell. that long blonde hair, curvy hips, and busty chest, wow.  

- Is this the same mirror universe we have seen before? Or a different one? Will the theme of Star Trek Discovery be similar to Sliders where they keep jumping from Universe to Universe trying to get home?  Or is this just a few episode arc?

I also believe that Mirror Universe Georgiou is the "faceless emperor."

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
27 minutes ago, Comiskeybum said:

Question is, what is Lorca's mission?

To kill the Emperor, I imagine. He's the most wanted man in his universe. Burnam has him. He may well plan to use her to make one last run at the kill.

My question is: what happened to DSC's Lorca? Is he dead? In that universe somewhere, stowed away, perhaps to ultimately convince Burnam to get him to the Emperor?

31 minutes ago, Comiskeybum said:

Is this the same mirror universe we have seen before? Or a different one? Will the theme of Star Trek Discovery be similar to Sliders where they keep jumping from Universe to Universe trying to get home?  Or is this just a few episode arc?

This seems like it will wrap before or with S1.And the Terran Empire symbology is markedly different.

33 minutes ago, Comiskeybum said:

I also believe that Mirror Universe Georgiou is the "faceless emperor."

That would be super fun.

 

35 minutes ago, Comiskeybum said:

- Captain Tillly is hot as hell. that long blonde hair, curvy hips, and busty chest, wow. 

Riker said it better than I could:

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Mr.Picard said:

Okay, I'm gonna rant first, then I'm gonna say how much I liked the rest of the episode.

SPOILERS

 

SPOILERS

 

SPOILERS

As a gay man, this episode infuriated me. Killing off Culber is the same old tired "kill your gays because they're icky" trope we see so much of. Yes, I know, the showrunners have said this isn't the end of Culber's story, and they will retcon this one way or another. But that doesn't matter, what's done is done. They used the "kill your gays" trope, and what's worse, they used it DESPITE knowing that it existed. Trek has a terrible history with LGBT characters (meaning: We're either not there or we're twisted Mirror Universe versions of "the good and nice straight characters"), and the fact that they resorted to this trope now REALLY REALLY REALLY doesn't help ANYTHING. I get it that this might be a trivial issue for non-minority folks, but for us this is a big deal, especially since the show went out of its way to tell us "you're part of Trek's future now". But hey, the first chance of using the "kill your gays" trope and they jump at it. And a certain group of Trek "fans" applauds, of course - "so glad they killed off one of the gays", "now I can finally watch this show with my kids", "Finally, Star Trek is back to being the Star Trek I know and love", etc. Well done, writers. Really, really smart move. Not.

Anyways.

The rest of the episode? I loved. I wish they had set this show in the Mirror Universe from the beginning. It makes so much more sense and everyone fits in so nicely. Especially Lorca, of course, but then, he fits in because... well, we all know why by now I guess.

I'll jump over to the Lorca topic for the next things I have to say because honestly HE WAS SO GOOD IN THIS EPISODE. LEATHER LORCA *hnnnnggggg*

 

I agree. It annoyed and upset me as well. But I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt for a few episodes. Since the show runner and several of the writers are gay, there might be more than it seems here.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this