Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0
kenman

Doctor Who Series 10 Discussion (with Spoilers)

44 posts in this topic

Posted (edited)

Just watched "Knock Knock". A good old "spook house" story, but IMO very solid. As far as I am concerned, spookhouses hardly ever get old. :laugh:

Now I think Robin is right, and this revisiting of familiar stories is intentional -- a kind of "best of medley" as a farewell for Moffat and Capaldi, perhaps? If they're later revisiting old-style Cybermen and other aliens from the classic series, that would make this season an intentional effort of exploring the show's past. I can think of worse concepts for a farewell season. :)

So while the episode was "recycling" again, I absolutely enjoyed watching it, even though I wasn't surprised. I liked the Doctor as "annoying grandpa", and the landlord was a nice guest role. By-the-book episode, but solid IMO.

Edited by Sim

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 hours ago, Sim said:

Just watched "Knock Knock". A good old "spook house" story, but IMO very solid. As far as I am concerned, spookhouses hardly ever get old. :laugh:

Now I think Robin is right, and this revisiting of familiar stories is intentional -- a kind of "best of medley" as a farewell for Moffat and Capaldi, perhaps? If they're later revisiting old-style Cybermen and other aliens from the classic series, that would make this season an intentional effort of exploring the show's past. I can think of worse concepts for a farewell season. :)

So while the episode was "recycling" again, I absolutely enjoyed watching it, even though I wasn't surprised. I liked the Doctor as "annoying grandpa", and the landlord was a nice guest role. By-the-book episode, but solid IMO.

^
Pretty much this.   The episode had many familiar elements, but I enjoyed it very much.   Once again, adoring Bill for just being herself; not a super-predestined warrior-chosen one, but for being the kind of girl who would ask the Doctor to use the Tardis to help her move!  :laugh:

As someone who LOATHES moving, I would gladly warp spacetime if it saved me from hauling heavy boxes from place to place...:P

Overall I thought "Knock, Knock" would've made a great Halloween episode if the broadcast order could've allowed it (which it couldn't; I understand).

Loved David Suchet's role as 'the landlord'; nice to see him again (used to watch his Hercule Poirot series on A&E years ago; I almost didn't recognize Suchet without his mustache and with that gray wig...).  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

For me the most fun part was when Bill began referring to The Doctor as her Grandfather.  I think given the retrospective tone of this season it was a nice touch.  I think it takes their relationship to a different, sentimental level than recent past companions.  Curious to see if this is a one time thing or if Bill will start to ask The Doctor about more of his past.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It was pretty good, wasn't it? The first three-quarters were creepy as hell. The wooden woman shouldn't have worked, but did, especially her slow reveal. Suchet was as brilliant as expected, turning from malevolent landlord to little-boy-lost on a penny. I thought it fell down slightly at the end with the convenient resurrection of Bill's friends ("Everybody lives!" again) and the house sinking into the earth, all very Hammer-style. Or Brian de Palma, if you like. Where did the bugs go? Was it okay to just leave them there? I guess they had no one controlling them so, yeah. Minor quibbles - overall, very enjoyable. The vault - that's got to be the Simm Master, no? Maybe they're double-bluffing us.

That's three hits out of four eps sp far this season. Still not wanting Capaldi to leave. i think his era has defined Moffat's far more than the Smith one.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, Robin Bland said:

It was pretty good, wasn't it? The first three-quarters were creepy as hell. The wooden woman shouldn't have worked, but did, especially her slow reveal. Suchet was as brilliant as expected, turning from malevolent landlord to little-boy-lost on a penny. I thought it fell down slightly at the end with the convenient resurrection of Bill's friends ("Everybody lives!" again) and the house sinking into the earth, all very Hammer-style. Or Brian de Palma, if you like. Where did the bugs go? Was it okay to just leave them there? I guess they had no one controlling them so, yeah. Minor quibbles - overall, very enjoyable. The vault - that's got to be the Simm Master, no? Maybe they're double-bluffing us.

That's three hits out of four eps sp far this season. Still not wanting Capaldi to leave. i think his era has defined Moffat's far more than the Smith one.

^
I thought I was the only one wondering what happened to the bugs... :laugh:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 minutes ago, Sehlat Vie said:

^
I thought I was the only one wondering what happened to the bugs... :laugh:

With Wooden Lady gone, I'm supposing they just become mindless, non-gestalt. Let's hope they're not otherwise problematic for the local flora and fauna... ;)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Robin Bland said:

With Wooden Lady gone, I'm supposing they just become mindless, non-gestalt. 

Or fodder for a sequel...? 

2 hours ago, Robin Bland said:

Let's hope they're not otherwise problematic for the local flora and fauna... ;)

Hehe... wooden stray cats, wooden dog, wooden sparrows.  :P

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Oxygen (ep 5) is bloody fantastic. Storming. Still reeling from how edge-of-the-seat and hardcore that was - gripping from start to finish. Also, Star Trek fans will love the opening line. Excellent character work, funny, poignant. Everything. Jamie Mathison has written another instant classic of an episode. 

I don't give scores but hell, that was 11/10. 

Also, the death of capitalism. ON POINT as usual, Who. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

5 hours ago, Robin Bland said:

Oxygen (ep 5) is bloody fantastic. Storming. Still reeling from how edge-of-the-seat and hardcore that was - gripping from start to finish. Also, Star Trek fans will love the opening line. Excellent character work, funny, poignant. Everything. Jamie Mathison has written another instant classic of an episode. 

I don't give scores but hell, that was 11/10. 

Also, the death of capitalism. ON POINT as usual, Who. 

^ Yes, this!

Great episode! By far the best this season so far, IMO! (Though I'm not sure it's 11/10 points... but bloody good at any rate.)

Gripping, thrilling, occasionally funny... and the capitalism critique is straight to the point -- Bert Brecht himself couldn't have made a more concise critique, if he had written for DW! :laugh:

And I wonder where they're going with the Doctor's eyesight next week... wasn't that Missy in the preview? Looking forward to the next episode! More like this, please! :thumbup:

Edited by Sim

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Robin Bland said:

Oxygen (ep 5) is bloody fantastic. Storming. Still reeling from how edge-of-the-seat and hardcore that was - gripping from start to finish. Also, Star Trek fans will love the opening line. Excellent character work, funny, poignant. Everything. Jamie Mathison has written another instant classic of an episode. 

I don't give scores but hell, that was 11/10. 

Also, the death of capitalism. ON POINT as usual, Who. 

^
That was a DW that really had something important to say; and more timely than ever.   Charging for air... seems absurd, right?  About as absurd as charging to... I don't know... mend someone's broken arm, or cure a child's cancer.   Timely as hell. 

And that cliffhanger (!!!).   My reaction below: 

14316564957.jpg

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

6 minutes ago, Sehlat Vie said:

^
That was a DW that really had something important to say; and more timely than ever.   Charging for air... seems absurd, right?  About as absurd as charging to... I don't know... mend someone's broken arm, or cure a child's cancer.   Timely as hell. 

 

Yeah... or, water.

The sharp yet concise critique of capitalist logic reminded me of Bertolt Brecht, who is THE classic German anti-capitalist author of the 1920s -- minus his bohemian pretentiousness. Like in "The Good Man from Sezhuan", where a water vendor literally has to develop a split identity to be able to be both a humane being, and a good vendor.

Edited by Sim

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Saw "Oxygen" last night as well and it was quite good indeed!  Part Zombie movie, part Capitalism analogy....great stuff all around!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, kenman said:

Saw "Oxygen" last night as well and it was quite good indeed!  Part Zombie movie, part Capitalism analogy....great stuff all around!

The zombie stuff reminded me a bit of "First Contact"; not saying that disparagingly or otherwise, but it did.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Sehlat Vie said:

The zombie stuff reminded me a bit of "First Contact"; not saying that disparagingly or otherwise, but it did.

Yeah a little bit, but definitely liked its own twist on Space Zombies. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

10.06 "Extremis". Hm, maybe I didn't get everything because I wasn't very focused, plus language barrier, but I'm a bit confused. Or am I supposed to be confused, because the riddle wasn't solved yet? So, from what point on were we seeing a hologram? And how is the hologram storyline connected to the Missy one -- is it a time jump, or is one the real and the other the holographic world? Maybe I should watch it again some time. Or next week's continuation will bring clarity.

Apart from that? I enjoyed it. The Doctor put the Pope in Billie's bedroom, hah. :laugh: And although we're dealing with another alien with the plan to conquer earth, it didn't feel like a repetition, but somewhat new.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Sim said:

10.06 "Extremis". Hm, maybe I didn't get everything because I wasn't very focused, plus language barrier, but I'm a bit confused. Or am I supposed to be confused, because the riddle wasn't solved yet? So, from what point on were we seeing a hologram? And how is the hologram storyline connected to the Missy one -- is it a time jump, or is one the real and the other the holographic world? Maybe I should watch it again some time. Or next week's continuation will bring clarity.

Apart from that? I enjoyed it. The Doctor put the Pope in Billie's bedroom, hah. :laugh: And although we're dealing with another alien with the plan to conquer earth, it didn't feel like a repetition, but somewhat new.

It's the first of a two parter, so it didn't properly 'end' per se. 

You didn't miss a conclusion, because it ended on a cliffhanger. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The point the ahologram begins is at the beginning when the Doctor sits at the Vault and recieves a message in the sunglasses, so essentially post opening titles up until the end. 

The connection to Missy seemed to be more thematic, and I am sure we will get more in the following episode...aso i love that the Doctor's blindness is not yet cured, and it barely could even be cured in the Hologram!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Extremis.

I enjoyed the rollercoaster ride of this one while I was in it, but it felt like a "shaggy dog story" at the end with its "It was all a dream" outcome. The bairn called this one "Cool but confusing." I agree with her. It felt like Steven Moffat throwing caution to the wind and mixing some Dan Brown with a few horror tropes and his own trademark plotty knots and having fun. It was great to watch, but afterwards, I'm scratching my head a bit. Why would the alien monks include the 'Vertitas' in their simulation anyway? Because it was perfect and such a thing exists in the real world? That would mean the real world is a sim-- oh, wait...  Plus, if it was perfect, it would surely randomize the way different simulants guessed numbers, wouldn't it? Uh? So it wasn't perfect? That seemed a bit dumb. I guess that's nitpicking. 

I liked the Missy bits a lot, though I was hoping the Vault wasn't just a Pandorica for Missy. That really is a Moffat trope, at this point. It's not 100% confirmed she's in there, so that may still be misdirection (and what I really want to know is, how did whoever is in there get a piano in there too if it's been sealed for a thousand years? And is there a candelabra on it? I guess it's bigger on the inside.) Nice to see HUMANS' Ivanno Jeremiah in a small role in those scenes. Fantastic actor who I hope finds his way back to Doctor Who in a larger role at some point. 

Speculation. The monks' open their mouths and words issue forth just like the original Cybermen from The Tenth Planet. Could there be a connection? We know those versions of the Cybermen are returning before this series' end. This is a simulation; are these monks Cybies without their suits? Nekkid Cybies? Perhaps not, as these guys appear in the next couple of episodes too. Maybe Moffat knows it's just a tremendously creepy effect. But it does seem weirdly coincidental... 

Overall, I thought it was a cool episode though. When Bill and Nardole were in the hologram generation room, did anyone else get a flashback to the TNG episode Contagion with its portals to other worlds? The bits where the Doctor was being chased with his eyesight failing were great. Nardole's "death" was genuinely disturbing. By the time of Bill's, I felt less invested. 

The bit with the "guilt" set-up with Penny for the gag with the Pope walking in was a bit of a "What?!" moment. 

I have to rewatch. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Robin Bland said:

I liked the Missy bits a lot, though I was hoping the Vault wasn't just a Pandorica for Missy. That really is a Moffat trope, at this point. It's not 100% confirmed she's in there, so that may still be misdirection (and what I really want to know is, how did whoever is in there get a piano in there too if it's been sealed for a thousand years? And is there a candelabra on it? I guess it's bigger on the inside.)

^ Was thinking the exact same thing; either it's an overused trope or... clever misdirection.  Either way, having Missy inside does seem more than a bit obvious.

1 hour ago, Robin Bland said:

Nice to see HUMANS' Ivanno Jeremiah in a small role in those scenes. Fantastic actor who I hope finds his way back to Doctor Who in a larger role at some point. 

He has a fascinating face; it's amazing how he can switch from unflinchingly benign in HUMANS to 'cowardly and cruel' in this latest DW (apologies to the Doctor, for stealing a piece of his mission statement...).  I would love to see him in other, more diverse roles.   For some reason, I can see him playing a Vulcan (don't ask...I think I see everyone as a closet Vulcan :P).

1 hour ago, Robin Bland said:

Speculation. The monks' open their mouths and words issue forth just like the original Cybermen from The Tenth Planet.

I wonder if this whole thing is some kind of Cybermen plot (?); if they're behind all of this somehow (?).

1 hour ago, Robin Bland said:

Nekkid Cybies?

Yikes! Thanks for that image over breakfast... :P

1 hour ago, Robin Bland said:

Overall, I thought it was a cool episode though. When Bill and Nardole were in the hologram generation room, did anyone else get a flashback to the TNG episode Contagion with its portals to other worlds?

Having recently bought S2 of TNG on blu ray, that's a resounding affirmative... ;)

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0