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Nombrecomun

General DC Discussion

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Actually, I always felt that Jackman looked and sounded enough like Wolverine. I think they had it right.

Aquaman is blond. They shouldn't cast an actor like Momoa for that role.

Those two pictures posted from the DCAU--exactly what I was talking about before. THIS is Aquaman as he should be written, though I find it interesting to see how he will fit into this movie.

Casting does matter, and it's not like Hollywood has a great track record with DC characters, especially in recent years.

Even the Bale trilogy, while well cast, was too concerned about being realistic to get that what this world is, is anything BUT realistic.

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Actually, I always felt that Jackman looked and sounded enough like Wolverine. I think they had it right.

Aquaman is blond. They shouldn't cast an actor like Momoa for that role.

Those two pictures posted from the DCAU--exactly what I was talking about before. THIS is Aquaman as he should be written, though I find it interesting to see how he will fit into this movie.

Casting does matter, and it's not like Hollywood has a great track record with DC characters, especially in recent years.

Even the Bale trilogy, while well cast, was too concerned about being realistic to get that what this world is, is anything BUT realistic.

This is the VERY reason why movies made from comic books require adaptation: because comic books are very different mediums of storytelling, and what works for one will NOT work in another.

The Dark Knight trilogy is not only a great comic book adaptation, but the movies also stand alone as great crime drama movies as well (in the same category as "Heat" and "Goodfellas"); NOT an easy feat....

You can't just slap comic book panels onto 35 mm film and call it a movie; that's a cartoon (it's what gets you style-over-subtance crap like 1980's "Flash Gordon" or 2008's craptacular "The Spirit").

Personally, I'm more concerned with making a good movie first, and a good 'comic book' second.

As for Momoa not being blonde?

Well, if that's your major hangup over the casting, I suggest you try to see past the hair and look into the actor's performance; who knows? You may even be pleasantly surprised.

The blonde James Bond worked out pretty well. Hair color is a superficial thing; it doesn't define a person or a character. That's cosmetic.

I don't see anyone trashing Zack Quinto's Spock because he is left-handed and Nimoy is right-handed, or slamming Urban's McCoy because he doesn't have De Kelley's blue eyes...

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Even the Bale trilogy, while well cast, was too concerned about being realistic to get that what this world is, is anything BUT realistic.

But that's what DC hasn't figured out. That's why Marvel works. Everything they do is as grounded and realistic as they can make it. The bigger the leap you ask the audience to make, the harder it is to make it and the more put off the audience is.

Taking Batman to "unrealistic" gets you Shumacher and we all know how well those were and are received.

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The first Superman movie, until the time travel, was a comic book adaptation that worked. Batman is not real. It's a fantasy. All of the DCAU is a fantasy. The fact that they are having Batman in the JL movie shows that they feel it's fine.

Taking Batman into unrealistic does NOT get you Shumacher. Shumacher gets you Shumacher. He was not the right guy.

It was not the right script.

The cartoons had some AMAZING scripts that absolutely would have worked live. Return of the Joker, was dark,gritty, and may be the best Batman story outside of a comic.

Marvel isn't grounded or realistic either. But the writing is typically better. It's the scripts.

DC characters are more larger than life than Marvel. That's not a bad thing.

I liked the Bale trilogy, but it was nowhere near the quality of the cartoons, and I feel it was overrated.

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The first Superman movie, until the time travel, was a comic book adaptation that worked. Batman is not real. It's a fantasy. All of the DCAU is a fantasy. The fact that they are having Batman in the JL movie shows that they feel it's fine.

Taking Batman into unrealistic does NOT get you Shumacher. Shumacher gets you Shumacher. He was not the right guy.

It was not the right script.

The cartoons had some AMAZING scripts that absolutely would have worked live. Return of the Joker, was dark,gritty, and may be the best Batman story outside of a comic.

Marvel isn't grounded or realistic either. But the writing is typically better. It's the scripts.

DC characters are more larger than life than Marvel. That's not a bad thing.

I liked the Bale trilogy, but it was nowhere near the quality of the cartoons, and I feel it was overrated.

Batman is a fantasy. So is Dirty Harry. So what?

And honestly, what is wrong with wanting a Batman movie done in a more realistic style?

Just as Bill Bixby's Hulk fought local bullies & corrupt mobsters, and not rock monsters or 20 ft. tall megalomaniacal villains.

It brings the comic book down to Earth; it makes the heroes relatable.

A more realistic style makes these characters come alive!

And you're right; the Marvel movies aren't particularly realistic; they're stylized. But they're not just comic books either. They strike a nice balance. And you're also right in that they're very well-written (and directed, and produced).

But I would also argue that DC made equally wonderful movies with its Dark Knight trilogy; they were elegant quasi-adaptations of some of the BEST Batman graphic novels ("Long Halloween" "Year One" and even a bit of "Dark Knight Returns") as well as freestanding, gritty crime dramas that stack up favorably to movies such as Michael Mann's "Heat" and "Carlito's Way."

Both styles work in their own respective ways; one needn't negate the other.

Sometimes you really CAN have the best of both worlds....

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Trying to take Batman down the road where you try to turn a comic book into a movie with no thought to adapting that to a movie audience does indeed get you Schumacher.The script has nothing to do with the cartoon presentation that Schumacher decided on.

And you can't tell me with a straight face that Winter Soldier isn't more grounded in a relatable world than, say, Green Lantern.

You just can't.

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Trying to take Batman down the road where you try to turn a comic book into a movie with no thought to adapting that to a movie audience does indeed get you Schumacher.The script has nothing to do with the cartoon presentation that Schumacher decided on.

And you can't tell me with a straight face that Winter Soldier isn't more grounded in a relatable world than, say, Green Lantern.

You just can't.

Winter Soldier has more in common with '70s espionage classics like "Three Days of the Condor" than any crap that Joel S#!t-maker pooped out of the Warners lot...

It is VERY possible to marry real-world sensibilities with comic book heroes or themes.

The successes of Winter Soldier, the Dark Knight trilogy and even the 5 year run of Kenneth Johnson's TV version of The Incredible Hulk bear this out...

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Aquaman is blond. They shouldn't cast an actor like Momoa for that role.

Those two pictures posted from the DCAU--exactly what I was talking about before. THIS is Aquaman as he should be written, though I find it interesting to see how he will fit into this movie.

I'm sorry but you're concentrating on the wrong thing when you view the pics. We posted them to give reference to the character in the animated series; certainly not to make a point about the hair colour. I'm sure the intrinsic aspects of a humanoid who breathes under water is enough to identify the character, not the colour of his spandex uniform, hair, etc...Momoa has an impressive physique. I'm sure that's the primary reason for his casting. I could care less about his hair.

Finally.... ;)

Frozen-Sing-a-Long-Let-It-Go1.jpg

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@ Nombrecomun~

OK now, let's not go the extra mile and be insulting, alright?

Disagreeing is totally cool; even with a bit of passion, but there's no need to hurl Disney sing-alongs at anyone... ;)

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LOL!!! Can't help it. I hear the song...every day. At least it's not a bad song.

And I really wish I knew how to make those pics smaller. I really didn't want to make it so big.

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LOL!!! Can't help it. I hear the song...every day. At least it's not a bad song.

And I really wish I knew how to make those pics smaller. I really didn't want to make it so big.

Yes, the song's repetitiveness is a bit annoying. But let's not use it insultingly at anyone, OK? :)

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I'm well aware those pictures were posted to reference the character, which actually illustrated my original point that the writing matters, and that comics and cartoons took care of the lame Aquaman problem.

But in EVERY incarnation of the character, he had blonde hair. Jason Momoa is not such a great actor that he was born to play Aquaman.

The casting judgments of the DC movie people have not been good since they cast the original Superman movies.

There are certain trademark physical features that are associated with characters. Aquaman IS blond and the fact that they chose to ignore that is not conclusive, but it is a bad sign.

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I'm well aware those pictures were posted to reference the character, which actually illustrated my original point that the writing matters, and that comics and cartoons took care of the lame Aquaman problem.

But in EVERY incarnation of the character, he had blonde hair. Jason Momoa is not such a great actor that he was born to play Aquaman.

The casting judgments of the DC movie people have not been good since they cast the original Superman movies.

There are certain trademark physical features that are associated with characters. Aquaman IS blond and the fact that they chose to ignore that is not conclusive, but it is a bad sign.

Or that the actor screen-tested so well for the part that his appearance didn't MATTER....

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But in EVERY incarnation of the character, he had blonde hair.

Except perhaps this one. Just because something has always been a certain way doesn't mean it can never be any other way. If that were true we'd still have "Whites only" drinking fountains, too.

Jason Momoa is not such a great actor that he was born to play Aquaman.

Seen his screen test to know that for sure? Have you leaped to the future and seen the finished film?

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We had a towheaded James Bond... and western civilization didn't collapse.

I'm pretty sure we'll endure a non-aryan Aquaman, too...

PS: And 1993's incarnation of Superman ("Lois & Clark") was played by half-Japanese American actor, Dean Cain. I thought he did a decent job, too.

DeanCain.jpg

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We had a towheaded James Bond... and western civilization didn't collapse.

I'm pretty sure we'll endure a non-aryan Aquaman, too...

I like the idea of Momoa in the part. He's got a badassness to him that I think the part will need in order to translate. And if they went "muscular blonde" I think they are probably going to invite comparisons (probably both unfair and unkind) to Thor.

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This is Jason Momoa, not Al Pacino.

His skills are not unique. One does not have to see a screentest to know this.

No one is arguing that western civilization is going to collapse, but that doesn't change that it's a sign that the writers don't even get the most simple aspects of the character, which is a bad sign for what the final product will be. It takes a certain level of writers' arrogance to make major changes to a character that is iconic. These writers do not have a track record of making good DC movies.

Aquaman is nothing like Thor. I don't think anyone would compare him to Thor. That's like saying it would be unfair to cast a dark haired man as Superman because Bruce Wayne has dark hair.

And physical appearance does matter. Does Al Pacino have the acting skills to play say, Wonder Woman? Stick him in the outfit, put a wig on him, and go?

I don't think that would work, no matter how well he reads the lines.

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This is Jason Momoa, not Al Pacino.

His skills are not unique. One does not have to see a screentest to know this.

No one is arguing that western civilization is going to collapse, but that doesn't change that it's a sign that the writers don't even get the most simple aspects of the character, which is a bad sign for what the final product will be. It takes a certain level of writers' arrogance to make major changes to a character that is iconic. These writers do not have a track record of making good DC movies.

Aquaman is nothing like Thor. I don't think anyone would compare him to Thor. That's like saying it would be unfair to cast a dark haired man as Superman because Bruce Wayne has dark hair.

And physical appearance does matter. Does Al Pacino have the acting skills to play say, Wonder Woman? Stick him in the outfit, put a wig on him, and go?

I don't think that would work, no matter how well he reads the lines.

Oh come on now... Aquaman is a minor footnote in the DC canon.

He's not nearly as iconic as James Bond, or Superman (who, as I pointed out was played by a half-Japanese American actor Dean Cain back in 1993-8).

As for Momoa's acting skills? How can you be so judgmental about a performance that NO ONE has yet seen?

And frankly, even Al Pacino isn't Al Pacino anymore; he was subtle and interesting back in the '70s, but now he just shouts like he's hailing a cab all the time.

And why is casting a non-blonde so 'arrogant'? Change can be a good thing. Who knows? In 5 years, Momoa's Aquaman could be the new 'iconic' version of the character...

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We had a towheaded James Bond... and western civilization didn't collapse.

I'm pretty sure we'll endure a non-aryan Aquaman, too...

I like the idea of Momoa in the part. He's got a badassness to him that I think the part will need in order to translate. And if they went "muscular blonde" I think they are probably going to invite comparisons (probably both unfair and unkind) to Thor.

He does look a bit badass, doesn't he?

Jason+Momoa+Workout.jpg

And here he is looking a bit more 'fair-haired', too.....

jason_momoa_99.jpg

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Aquaman is nothing like Thor. I don't think anyone would compare him to Thor.

Flowing blonde and buff, that's enough. Add to that the issue that much of the fanbase for potential comic book movies have seen DCs previous slapdash efforts and much of that fanbase is displeased with this mad rush to screen and you have a perfect recipe for comparison.

And, many casual popcorn munchers, who know nothing of the comics beyond the screen and, like it or not are the reason any of these films make money, are going to think "Water Thor."

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We had a towheaded James Bond... and western civilization didn't collapse.

I'm pretty sure we'll endure a non-aryan Aquaman, too...

I like the idea of Momoa in the part. He's got a badassness to him that I think the part will need in order to translate. And if they went "muscular blonde" I think they are probably going to invite comparisons (probably both unfair and unkind) to Thor.

He does look a bit badass, doesn't he?

Jason+Momoa+Workout.jpg

And here he is looking a bit more 'fair-haired', too.....

jason_momoa_99.jpg

I think if I saw that dude rising up out of the water I'd be a little nervous, yeah. :)

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He's 6'4" and has a big scar over his eye.

210833-jason-momoa-for-batman-vs-superma

If I were a marine creature?

giphy.gif

Pretty sure I'd ink myself, too.... :giggle:

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Well, let's not forget Nick Fury went from white to black and as far as I'm concerned it's the best thing ever. Look at how it has paid dividends in the Marvel franchise. No one except comic book fans knew anything about Nick Fury so it didn't matter. Same could be said for Aquaman as others have pointed out. He's not a big character.

Change is good, m'kay? M'kay.

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No one except comic book fans knew anything about Nick Fury so it didn't matter. Same could be said for Aquaman as others have pointed out. He's not a big character.

Exactly this.

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Well, let's not forget Nick Fury went from white to black and as far as I'm concerned it's the best thing ever. Look at how it has paid dividends in the Marvel franchise. No one except comic book fans knew anything about Nick Fury so it didn't matter. Same could be said for Aquaman as others have pointed out. He's not a big character.

Change is good, m'kay? M'kay.

Nick Fury!

A very good example.

An iconic (and traditionally white) Marvel character is turned from a mullet-haired cyclopean, mercenary-looking white guy into a cyclopean Samuel L. Jackson.

And I haven't heard ONE complaint anywhere about Marvel 'not being true to the most basic aspects of the Fury character' (such as keeping Fury white).

Why aren't there complaints? Because NO ONE cares.

If the actor is good, they make the character their OWN. If you're lucky enough to score Samuel Jackson for your movie? You TAKE him (gladly!).

I don't know Jason Momoa from Adam, but I assume his audition was at least decent otherwise he wouldn't have gotten the gig.

And I also think that an actor of more mixed ethnicity better reflects the world we live in now; the demographics of the US are changing.

The United States has become a lot more racially and socially inclusive since I was a kid. The image of the lantern-jawed, square, perfectly coiffed caucasian guy saving the day is a bit dated, frankly.

Nick Fury is played by Samuel Jackson. Half-Japanese American Dean Cain played Superman in the 1990s. Why not have a more ethnically mixed Aquaman?

I read that Momoa is part-Hawaiian (Polynesian); he is also parts German & Irish. And of all the states in the US, which one better screams 'Aquaman' than Hawaii?

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