Chimera82405

Petition to Change the Star Trek Fan Film Guidelines

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STAR TREK FAN FILMS WILL LIVE! SAVE FAN FILMS!

Although we actually can't directly make a difference against the strange new fan film guidelines, here is a petition to amend them, according to the rights given in the final paragraph, where the studio claims it has the right to change it. If the studio system can do that, so can the fans, at least so far as voicing their opinions.

Is there anything fans can do to prevent some of the sticky points of the guidelines from actually taking effect? Yes! If they have a blog, a You Tube, Facebook or some other media, they can come out in numbers. They can protest the guidelines on their blogs. They can use as nice a wording as possible, as not to be profane, and make a claim that most of what the guidelines are dispenses with free expression and love of a 50 year old series.

The limit on story length and episode length stifles freedom and makes it hard to find videos legally, as does changing the titles to not say Star Trek. Many sites contain filters fo length based on ad sense and if you are a member of the site, and you should not have ad sense on when posting any fan film.

A Star Trek fan film may go back to being 45 minutes or longer, if need be, so long as there is credit given to the original work, but again, no ads allowed.

The family friendly clause is limited free expression. Web sites contain filters. Use them. The studio cannot dictate what is filtered.

The clause that claims five different ways, 'Star Trek belongs to CBS and Paramount' should just say that, not five times, but once. This already means that any use of the logos, props, models, uniforms, music, etc, is part of that franchise, and you cannot give or receive any profit for any monies at all, from any sales or online revenue.

The added clause that comments on the uniforms should be fixed so that it says 'use only non professional uniforms', props, and other media and original music'. 

The clause that you may not use existing copyrighted music is valid. However, the one about making the look of uniform or props less like Trek makes them 'transformative' or 'transitive' and thus it is a fan production and not an official one.

The one about actors not being in it, or allowed, is worded badly. How about if you have an actor who wishes to be in it, the actor may appear so long as he or she is not being paid. Thus the actor is doing so as a volunteer.

Parody or transformative works are fair use.

Fan films may have volunteer staff and support (donation kick starter),  so long as they do not make any profit, but that any donations come as gifts and not as salary. The clause where they claim you can't do that is not right.

Instead of the long legal drawn out disclaimer stuck over all the future fan films, make that a lot clearer somehow, perhaps something like this.

"This is a fan production. STAR TREK and all related content herein are copyright, CBS and Paramount Pictures, so that this fan film is a transformative work and not official and will not incur any profit from any distribution or products herein. This complies with the DMCA rules and internet guidelines and meets with the studio guidelines."

Any ideas on what could be changed on that sheet the studio posted and what would make it better for fan films? These were my few ideas.

 

 

Edited by Chimera82405

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If you're Paramount, would you listen to that?  It's frustrating. 

Grass roots movements saved ST before... 

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If you're Paramount, would you listen to that?  It's frustrating. 

Grass roots movements saved ST before... 

but Star Trek is mostly fine. A profitable movie series and an exciting new TV series is in the works. Just this one bummer of a thing is happening. 

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Yeah, but that was nearly 50 years ago.  Different times, different people in charge.  Back then, a letter meant 1000 people.  Today, signing an online petition takes 2 seconds, it's easy to basically artificially pump up the numbers, and it's an easy thing to do.

 

So if I'm Paramount, I view it for what it could very well be--a few angry fans that won't have much effect on the bottom line. 

I honestly think the best tactic is for Star Trek Continues to try to make a phone call, meet with them, and discuss things.  Does Paramount really want to come off as villains, and anger fans at the same time as the 50th anniversary?  Paramount has nothing to lose by taking the meeting and talking. 

There are certain realities--while STC has not reached the mainstream audience that a Paramount sanctioned production reaches, some of their videos have over 1 million views.  Let's say that video was viewed 3 times by each viewer.  That's STILL 333000 people who have seen it, and odds are, that's not what happened.

That's no small figure of people, and the views of this production are positive.

It's pretty clear that these guidelines are a reaction, or overreaction, to Axanar.  So if I'm Paramount, and I want to cater to the fans, which I should want to do if I'm Paramount, then I send a message that I hear you, I realize STC is a good thing, and I grant them a license.

I would allow them to do what they have been doing, but no profit allowed.  I might even consider allowing a profit as long as a percentage goes to Paramount.

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Yeah, but that was nearly 50 years ago.  Different times, different people in charge.  Back then, a letter meant 1000 people.  Today, signing an online petition takes 2 seconds, it's easy to basically artificially pump up the numbers, and it's an easy thing to do.

 

So if I'm Paramount, I view it for what it could very well be--a few angry fans that won't have much effect on the bottom line. 

I honestly think the best tactic is for Star Trek Continues to try to make a phone call, meet with them, and discuss things.  Does Paramount really want to come off as villains, and anger fans at the same time as the 50th anniversary?  Paramount has nothing to lose by taking the meeting and talking. 

There are certain realities--while STC has not reached the mainstream audience that a Paramount sanctioned production reaches, some of their videos have over 1 million views.  Let's say that video was viewed 3 times by each viewer.  That's STILL 333000 people who have seen it, and odds are, that's not what happened.

That's no small figure of people, and the views of this production are positive.

It's pretty clear that these guidelines are a reaction, or overreaction, to Axanar.  So if I'm Paramount, and I want to cater to the fans, which I should want to do if I'm Paramount, then I send a message that I hear you, I realize STC is a good thing, and I grant them a license.

I would allow them to do what they have been doing, but no profit allowed.  I might even consider allowing a profit as long as a percentage goes to Paramount.

^
I agree.

I think some kind of meeting with CBS/P would be a wise step for STC.   Given at their implicitly open and amenable relationship with the studio, I can't imagine this would be an impossible hurtle to overcome.   And yes, the viewing figures (not to mention the slew of awards) for STC have enough merit to warrant some studio recognition and/or attention.

And no profit is the smartest way to continue.   STC is currently on the books as a NPO.   They should do everything they can to maintain that status as it puts them in a better position to deal with Paramount.    Any hint of profiteering or profit sharing (even with the studio) is a slippery slope towards losing that purity. 

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Although we actually can't directly make a difference against the strange new fan film guidelines, here is a petition to amend them, according to the rights given in the final paragraph, where the studio claims it has the right to change it. If the studio system can do that, so can the fans, at least so far as voicing their opinions.

You can try, sure. (shrug) 

The family friendly clause is limited free expression. Web sites contain filters. Use them. The studio cannot dictate what is filtered.

Sure they can...if said website ever wants access to CBS/Para's legit content or ad money. That and you have no right to free expression between yourself and another company, and not with someone else's IP.

Yeah, but that was nearly 50 years ago.  Different times, different people in charge.  Back then, a letter meant 1000 people. Today, signing an online petition takes 2 seconds, it's easy to basically artificially pump up the numbers, and it's an easy thing to do.

 You know, you're right all around. Online petitions are simple. They're simple to create and sign and are now meaningless.

But the 50 year-old solution would work best. IF there's that much fan rage...write letters...flood CBS with actual letters.

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Although we actually can't directly make a difference against the strange new fan film guidelines, here is a petition to amend them, according to the rights given in the final paragraph, where the studio claims it has the right to change it. If the studio system can do that, so can the fans, at least so far as voicing their opinions.

You can try, sure. (shrug) 

The family friendly clause is limited free expression. Web sites contain filters. Use them. The studio cannot dictate what is filtered.

Sure they can...if said website ever wants access to CBS/Para's legit content or ad money. That and you have no right to free expression between yourself and another company, and not with someone else's IP.

Yeah, but that was nearly 50 years ago.  Different times, different people in charge.  Back then, a letter meant 1000 people. Today, signing an online petition takes 2 seconds, it's easy to basically artificially pump up the numbers, and it's an easy thing to do.

 You know, you're right all around. Online petitions are simple. They're simple to create and sign and are now meaningless.

But the 50 year-old solution would work best. IF there's that much fan rage...write letters...flood CBS with actual letters.

Letters?  What are letters?  :laugh:

Seriously, the letters would be the best option for those who care.  Since I have never really watched any of the fan films except for Axanar this is a non-issue for me.

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Although we actually can't directly make a difference against the strange new fan film guidelines, here is a petition to amend them, according to the rights given in the final paragraph, where the studio claims it has the right to change it. If the studio system can do that, so can the fans, at least so far as voicing their opinions.

You can try, sure. (shrug) 

The family friendly clause is limited free expression. Web sites contain filters. Use them. The studio cannot dictate what is filtered.

Sure they can...if said website ever wants access to CBS/Para's legit content or ad money. That and you have no right to free expression between yourself and another company, and not with someone else's IP.

Yeah, but that was nearly 50 years ago.  Different times, different people in charge.  Back then, a letter meant 1000 people. Today, signing an online petition takes 2 seconds, it's easy to basically artificially pump up the numbers, and it's an easy thing to do.

 You know, you're right all around. Online petitions are simple. They're simple to create and sign and are now meaningless.

But the 50 year-old solution would work best. IF there's that much fan rage...write letters...flood CBS with actual letters.

Letters?  What are letters?  :laugh:

Seriously, the letters would be the best option for those who care.  Since I have never really watched any of the fan films except for Axanar this is a non-issue for me.

^
Agreed.

Time to go retro on this one... 

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I'll admit I find those guidelines over-reaching.

But Axanar over-reached FIRST.

They went too far and forced a significant (and perhaps drastic) reaction: and this is what we have as a result.

Crowd-funding was always going to cause problems, but crowd-funding $1 million?  Yeah, thats enough for TPTB to say "hmm"...

Fan films filled a void for this desert we've been in for a while, but, the day is over I feel. 

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I said when STC's latest fundraising campaign fell short, that it isn't just the Axanar thing...but it also doesn't help that there are a lot (I assume) of Trek fans (like myself) who only turned to fan films when the desire for new Trek lead me to seeking this stuff out. With new legit Trek on the horizon?  The need begins to wain.  Fans of the fan films are a minority of fandom.  I agree with Frontier...the day of the fan film is at an end...but at least we are getting new Trek from TPTB!

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I said when STC's latest fundraising campaign fell short, that it isn't just the Axanar thing...but it also doesn't help that there are a lot (I assume) of Trek fans (like myself) who only turned to fan films when the desire for new Trek lead me to seeking this stuff out. With new legit Trek on the horizon?  The need begins to wain.  Fans of the fan films are a minority of fandom.  I agree with Frontier...the day of the fan film is at an end...but at least we are getting new Trek from TPTB!

There may be lean times again, and when there are?  There won't be any outlet for fans to express themselves.  It's kind of sad, really.   The fan movement, be it grassroots conventions, 8mm films in the '70s, fanzines, etc were what kept ST alive an in the public consciousness during some VERY lean times.   Now it's all being summarily dismissed and forgotten.

Granted, ST is CBS/P's IP (and I get that this is primarily retaliatory for "Axanar") but I think the studio has way overreacted...

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The studio HAD to react though. They couldn't let Axanar go on like this, and if they had made the rules less strict, Axanar quickly would have found ways around everything and we soon would have been in the very same situation again. Don't get me wrong, I dislike the rules as much as most other fans do (and I have never even seen a fan film nor do I wish to do so) but I CAN kinda see the studio's point here.

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The studio HAD to react though. They couldn't let Axanar go on like this, and if they had made the rules less strict, Axanar quickly would have found ways around everything and we soon would have been in the very same situation again. Don't get me wrong, I dislike the rules as much as most other fans do (and I have never even seen a fan film nor do I wish to do so) but I CAN kinda see the studio's point here.

And I agree they are within their rights, but seeing as how ST was an enterprise (NPI) built largely around fan support initially, this seems like bad PR to treat honest fans so terribly (on the anniversary, no less).   But, as you say, it IS their IP and they can do whatever they wish with it, I suppose... 

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The thing is, Fair Use gets thrown around a lot by people who don't seem to really know what it means...and it is a big problem on the internet.  People seem to think Fair Use means " I can do whatever I want with any famous property" when it really doesn't mean that at all.  CBS/Paramount had a big issue on their hand, and they needed to make it clear who was boss in this thing...and they couldn't afford to weaken their grasp on the copyright, 50th Anniversary or not...

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The studio HAD to react though. They couldn't let Axanar go on like this, and if they had made the rules less strict, Axanar quickly would have found ways around everything and we soon would have been in the very same situation again. Don't get me wrong, I dislike the rules as much as most other fans do (and I have never even seen a fan film nor do I wish to do so) but I CAN kinda see the studio's point here.

But that doesn't mean some of the other star trek fan films have to suffer the consequences though!, if only Alec Peters hadn't peed in CBS's/Paramount's cornflakes this wouldn't have happened!

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The studio HAD to react though. They couldn't let Axanar go on like this, and if they had made the rules less strict, Axanar quickly would have found ways around everything and we soon would have been in the very same situation again. Don't get me wrong, I dislike the rules as much as most other fans do (and I have never even seen a fan film nor do I wish to do so) but I CAN kinda see the studio's point here.

But that doesn't mean some of the other star trek fan films have to suffer the consequences though!, if only Alec Peters hadn't peed in CBS's/Paramount's cornflakes this wouldn't have happened!

Maybe...but be happy they let these people get so far for so long. 

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The studio HAD to react though. They couldn't let Axanar go on like this, and if they had made the rules less strict, Axanar quickly would have found ways around everything and we soon would have been in the very same situation again. Don't get me wrong, I dislike the rules as much as most other fans do (and I have never even seen a fan film nor do I wish to do so) but I CAN kinda see the studio's point here.

But that doesn't mean some of the other star trek fan films have to suffer the consequences though!, if only Alec Peters hadn't peed in CBS's/Paramount's cornflakes this wouldn't have happened!

Actually that's exactly what it means. That can't just kill Axanar and let everyone else be, and Mr. Picard is very right in that, if the rules weren't so crushing that they crushed Axanar, they would have played around with the boundaries even more.

It all had to end.

Edited by prometheus59650

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The studio HAD to react though. They couldn't let Axanar go on like this, and if they had made the rules less strict, Axanar quickly would have found ways around everything and we soon would have been in the very same situation again. Don't get me wrong, I dislike the rules as much as most other fans do (and I have never even seen a fan film nor do I wish to do so) but I CAN kinda see the studio's point here.

But that doesn't mean some of the other star trek fan films have to suffer the consequences though!, if only Alec Peters hadn't peed in CBS's/Paramount's cornflakes this wouldn't have happened!

Actually that's exactly what it means. That can't just kill Axanar and let everyone else be, and Mr. Picard is very right in that, if the rules weren't so crushing that they crushed Axanar, they would have played around with the boundaries even more.

It all had to end.

No it ain't over until we say it's over!

 

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The studio HAD to react though. They couldn't let Axanar go on like this, and if they had made the rules less strict, Axanar quickly would have found ways around everything and we soon would have been in the very same situation again. Don't get me wrong, I dislike the rules as much as most other fans do (and I have never even seen a fan film nor do I wish to do so) but I CAN kinda see the studio's point here.

But that doesn't mean some of the other star trek fan films have to suffer the consequences though!, if only Alec Peters hadn't peed in CBS's/Paramount's cornflakes this wouldn't have happened!

Actually that's exactly what it means. That can't just kill Axanar and let everyone else be, and Mr. Picard is very right in that, if the rules weren't so crushing that they crushed Axanar, they would have played around with the boundaries even more.

It all had to end.

No it ain't over until we say it's over!

 

I'm feeling a Commander Peter Q. Taggart moment coming on...

giphy-20.gif  ;)

 

Color me blind optimist, but I really don't think this is the end of fan films.  For the moment perhaps, but not indefinitely.... 

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The studio HAD to react though. They couldn't let Axanar go on like this, and if they had made the rules less strict, Axanar quickly would have found ways around everything and we soon would have been in the very same situation again. Don't get me wrong, I dislike the rules as much as most other fans do (and I have never even seen a fan film nor do I wish to do so) but I CAN kinda see the studio's point here.

But that doesn't mean some of the other star trek fan films have to suffer the consequences though!, if only Alec Peters hadn't peed in CBS's/Paramount's cornflakes this wouldn't have happened!

Actually that's exactly what it means. That can't just kill Axanar and let everyone else be, and Mr. Picard is very right in that, if the rules weren't so crushing that they crushed Axanar, they would have played around with the boundaries even more.

It all had to end.

No it ain't over until we say it's over!

 

I'm feeling a Commander Peter Q. Taggart moment coming on...

giphy-20.gif  ;)

 

Color me blind optimist, but I really don't think this is the end of fan films.  For the moment perhaps, but not indefinitely.... 

We have to keep fighting, no matter what happens! for Trekkies everywhere!

 

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The studio HAD to react though. They couldn't let Axanar go on like this, and if they had made the rules less strict, Axanar quickly would have found ways around everything and we soon would have been in the very same situation again. Don't get me wrong, I dislike the rules as much as most other fans do (and I have never even seen a fan film nor do I wish to do so) but I CAN kinda see the studio's point here.

But that doesn't mean some of the other star trek fan films have to suffer the consequences though!, if only Alec Peters hadn't peed in CBS's/Paramount's cornflakes this wouldn't have happened!

Actually that's exactly what it means. That can't just kill Axanar and let everyone else be, and Mr. Picard is very right in that, if the rules weren't so crushing that they crushed Axanar, they would have played around with the boundaries even more.

It all had to end.

No it ain't over until we say it's over!

 

I'm feeling a Commander Peter Q. Taggart moment coming on...

giphy-20.gif  ;)

 

Color me blind optimist, but I really don't think this is the end of fan films.  For the moment perhaps, but not indefinitely.... 

We have to keep fighting, no matter what happens! for Trekkies everywhere!

 

Petitions, letters, whatever it takes.

Who knows?  There's even a slim possibility that STC's negotiations might bear some fruit (?).   I'm just not ready to close the casket on fan films.  Especially since they've finally come of age in the 21st century.   The fans were (in the '70s) the force that essentially brought a canceled TV show back from the dead (with conventions, fanzines, word-of-mouth, 8mm films, etc).   The fans even mobilized and got then-president Gerald Ford to rename the space shuttle prototype "Enterprise" (it was originally designated "Constitution").   And all of this WITHOUT the resources of the internet (!).  

I think it's over when we fans decide that we don't even want to try...

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The studio HAD to react though. They couldn't let Axanar go on like this, and if they had made the rules less strict, Axanar quickly would have found ways around everything and we soon would have been in the very same situation again. Don't get me wrong, I dislike the rules as much as most other fans do (and I have never even seen a fan film nor do I wish to do so) but I CAN kinda see the studio's point here.

But that doesn't mean some of the other star trek fan films have to suffer the consequences though!, if only Alec Peters hadn't peed in CBS's/Paramount's cornflakes this wouldn't have happened!

Actually that's exactly what it means. That can't just kill Axanar and let everyone else be, and Mr. Picard is very right in that, if the rules weren't so crushing that they crushed Axanar, they would have played around with the boundaries even more.

It all had to end.

No it ain't over until we say it's over!

 

I'm feeling a Commander Peter Q. Taggart moment coming on...

giphy-20.gif  ;)

 

Color me blind optimist, but I really don't think this is the end of fan films.  For the moment perhaps, but not indefinitely.... 

We have to keep fighting, no matter what happens! for Trekkies everywhere!

 

Petitions, letters, whatever it takes.

Who knows?  There's even a slim possibility that STC's negotiations might bear some fruit (?).   I'm just not ready to close the casket on fan films.  Especially since they've finally come of age in the 21st century.   The fans were (in the '70s) the force that essentially brought a canceled TV show back from the dead (with conventions, fanzines, word-of-mouth, 8mm films, etc).   The fans even mobilized and got then-president Gerald Ford to rename the space shuttle prototype "Enterprise" (it was originally designated "Constitution").   And all of this WITHOUT the resources of the internet (!).  

I think it's over when we fans decide that we don't even want to try...

We just need to send Chimera's message to CBS and Paramount(If we can get their email addresses) hoping they will listen! (And maybe force an apology from Alec Peters for causing all this to happen)

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I just love fan creativity and myself am a fan artist. I for one would support any fan film than I would any new movie/series. I'm not sure how you can beat them but I will say that it just takes one fool to ruin a good thing which is people's creativity being silenced.

 

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The studio HAD to react though. They couldn't let Axanar go on like this, and if they had made the rules less strict, Axanar quickly would have found ways around everything and we soon would have been in the very same situation again. Don't get me wrong, I dislike the rules as much as most other fans do (and I have never even seen a fan film nor do I wish to do so) but I CAN kinda see the studio's point here.

But that doesn't mean some of the other star trek fan films have to suffer the consequences though!, if only Alec Peters hadn't peed in CBS's/Paramount's cornflakes this wouldn't have happened!

Actually that's exactly what it means. That can't just kill Axanar and let everyone else be, and Mr. Picard is very right in that, if the rules weren't so crushing that they crushed Axanar, they would have played around with the boundaries even more.

It all had to end.

No it ain't over until we say it's over!

 

I'm feeling a Commander Peter Q. Taggart moment coming on...

giphy-20.gif  ;)

 

Color me blind optimist, but I really don't think this is the end of fan films.  For the moment perhaps, but not indefinitely.... 

We have to keep fighting, no matter what happens! for Trekkies everywhere!

 

Petitions, letters, whatever it takes.

Who knows?  There's even a slim possibility that STC's negotiations might bear some fruit (?).   I'm just not ready to close the casket on fan films.  Especially since they've finally come of age in the 21st century.   The fans were (in the '70s) the force that essentially brought a canceled TV show back from the dead (with conventions, fanzines, word-of-mouth, 8mm films, etc).   The fans even mobilized and got then-president Gerald Ford to rename the space shuttle prototype "Enterprise" (it was originally designated "Constitution").   And all of this WITHOUT the resources of the internet (!).  

I think it's over when we fans decide that we don't even want to try...

We just need to send Chimera's message to CBS and Paramount(If we can get their email addresses) hoping they will listen! (And maybe force an apology from Alec Peters for causing all this to happen)

Peters would sooner slice off his own fingers with a dull butter knife before he apologizes... the man is the living embodiment of arrogance.

But even so, I still think there's a chance with the more honest fan films (STC for example) having a shot with CBS.  Not all of them should suffer so harshly for Axanar's hubris. 

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