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Robin Bland

Star Wars: Han Solo Movie

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When I am mentioning Ford in this case, I am referring to 1977 Ford, not the TFA Ford.  I totally agree the character warmed up and developed a lot.

There is something important here for the script.  You can't make Han TOO much of a bad person.  The core of that man had to be good.  There had to be lines he wouldn't cross.  They can't make him irredeemable.  Imagine if they did something ridiculously stupid, like having Han kill a bunch of kids.  How could we possibly like the character after that?  Something like that would ruin even the Ford movies because Han would be a monster and his redemption would be unacceptable.  I doubt any writer would do anything so dumb though.

Han has to walk the line, but still be on the right side of it.  Even when he shot first, I would still argue self defense.  He was cornered and in a position where he felt his life was in danger. 

 

Oh, I agree.
I wouldn't want to see Han go on a murdering spree because he was bored one 
evening.  Nor would I like to see him as an Imperial snitch just for kicks.  But lets' face it; Han wasn't a boy scout either.   Yes, he was cornered with Greedo and had little choice, but it was the callous way he did it.   He seemed to have no more issue with killing someone than he did with turning out the lights as he left a room.   Greedo was NOT his first (and I'm sure that not all of them were no-choice scenarios, either).

And Han was a smuggler working for a very sadistic and cruel crime lord; the Hutts were into slavery and gods-know-what-the-hell else.  Why was Han having anything to do with that creep, anyway?   Han probably smuggled some very harmful contraband in his day, I'd imagine (just what the hell is 'spice,' anyway?  A narcotic/space-time warper, as it was in "Dune"?).   So let's be aboveboard on that.   Perhaps he never did anything totally irredeemable, but the movie shouldn't shy too far away from who he was either...

No, he probably wasn't a baby-killer, but he was most likely a drug smuggler; and at the very least a killer.    I imagine his early career to be kind of like Mal in "Firefly/Serenity"; he tries to be a nice guy, but he can go full-bore bad guy when he needs to (as Mal did in the movie "Serenity").   Mal was more ethical than younger Han Solo, I think; but he could still be dangerous as well. 

I'd also be curious as to what DROVE a guy like Han into a life of crime, anyway?   That must be a helluva story.   I hope this standalone movie addresses that...

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If I'm not mistaken, you have watched Breaking Bad, and if you did, I would think you watch Better Call Saul.  I see Han almost like a Saul Goodman in a way.  He's someone that walks the line, and may even cross it slightly, but he's not evil.  He'll have a presence with the bad guys, but he's not a full fledged bad guy.  He has a moral compass.

Han never did anything that would be so terrible you couldn't like him.  Smuggling?  Sure, but I actually DON'T see him as a drug smuggler.  He would work for Jabba, but likely take jobs that aren't so horrible.  I could see him smuggling certain cargo that he has no clue what's in there--no questions asked.  But I don't see him as a BAD person--just someone who likes a buck and will walk that line for the money.

 

It's just been too long since I've seen Firefly to really relate to your analogy.  I also see Han kind of like Quark too, at least from a business standpoint.  Obviously not EXACTLY like that, but with somewhat of a similar moral compass.

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Mal Reynolds from Firefly was so clearly modeled on Han Solo it was imitation as the sincerest form of flattery. 

Whether Kasdan will follow the accepted fan lore of what Han was or wasn't prior to ANH remains to be seen. Solo's big problem, and the reason he was never quite the most successful smuggler ever, is precisely because he did have a moral code, no matter how much he tried to hide it. "Cynical" - the verb always associated with the character from SW77 - implies that there was a disillusionment somewhere along the way, that he learned to survive, and in the times of the rise of the Empire, it's easy to see how a guy who is generally good-hearted might become very cynical and look after himself and a co-pilot and to chase the biggest pay checks, even if the slug issuing them is Jabba the Hutt. To my mind, it's also easy to see that this same guy might, behind the scenes, rescue a Wookie or do good deeds when he thought no-one was looking. Money became his goal - so he worked for the highest bidder because, in a galaxy that no longer enshrined scruples on the part of the individual in any way at all, survival and looking after one's self was the only sensible option. he had a rep to keep up - and the last thing he wanted was to be known as a good guy, a soft touch, so he was probably harder than anyone else when backed into a corner. 

And, as played in ANH, it took Leia and Luke to reawaken in him the latent potential of believing in a larger world, of co-operating with people on behalf of a greater good. 

That is, I think, one of the reasons why Star Wars (77 and ANH incarnations) remains so powerful. It's the story of a bunch of would-be friends, thrown together and becoming something much more. It might be myth, but that stuff really does happen in real life too. 

Just my interpretation of the character around that period, of course. But I'm hoping someone as eminent and sussed as Kasdan will think similarly, and we'll get a story that takes in all these shadings to the character, plus more I haven't thought of. 

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Mal Reynolds from Firefly was so clearly modeled on Han Solo it was imitation as the sincerest form of flattery. 

Whether Kasdan will follow the accepted fan lore of what Han was or wasn't prior to ANH remains to be seen. Solo's big problem, and the reason he was never quite the most successful smuggler ever, is precisely because he did have a moral code, no matter how much he tried to hide it. "Cynical" - the verb always associated with the character from SW77 - implies that there was a disillusionment somewhere along the way, that he learned to survive, and in the times of the rise of the Empire, it's easy to see how a guy who is generally good-hearted might become very cynical and look after himself and a co-pilot and to chase the biggest pay checks, even if the slug issuing them is Jabba the Hutt. To my mind, it's also easy to see that this same guy might, behind the scenes, rescue a Wookie or do good deeds when he thought no-one was looking. Money became his goal - so he worked for the highest bidder because, in a galaxy that no longer enshrined scruples on the part of the individual in any way at all, survival and looking after one's self was the only sensible option. he had a rep to keep up - and the last thing he wanted was to be known as a good guy, a soft touch, so he was probably harder than anyone else when backed into a corner. 

And, as played in ANH, it took Leia and Luke to reawaken in him the latent potential of believing in a larger world, of co-operating with people on behalf of a greater good. 

That is, I think, one of the reasons why Star Wars (77 and ANH incarnations) remains so powerful. It's the story of a bunch of would-be friends, thrown together and becoming something much more. It might be myth, but that stuff really does happen in real life too. 

Just my interpretation of the character around that period, of course. But I'm hoping someone as eminent and sussed as Kasdan will think similarly, and we'll get a story that takes in all these shadings to the character, plus more I haven't thought of. 

^
I agree with much of this.

Yeah, I think Mal was very much modeled on Solo, and as you say, it was sincerest flattery.   Even in the audio commentary of the last "Firefly" episode, "Objects in Space" when Serenity was boarded by bounty hunter Jubal Early, Whedon states that Early was Boba Fett and Mal was Solo (to a degree).

I also agree that Han always had a heart of gold deep inside (one of the reasons why he was so unsuccessful as a criminal), but we the audience shouldn't see too much of that in a Han Solo prequel;  his friendship with Luke (and the rebellion) and his love of Leia are what brought those qualities out in him.   Before then, he was (wannabe) Gary Cooper in Space.   

 

 

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Whether Kasdan will follow the accepted fan lore of what Han was or wasn't prior to ANH remains to be seen. Solo's big problem, and the reason he was never quite the most successful smuggler ever, is precisely because he did have a moral code, no matter how much he tried to hide it. "Cynical" - the verb always associated with the character from SW77 - implies that there was a disillusionment somewhere along the way, that he learned to survive, and in the times of the rise of the Empire, it's easy to see how a guy who is generally good-hearted might become very cynical and look after himself and a co-pilot and to chase the biggest pay checks, even if the slug issuing them is Jabba the Hutt. To my mind, it's also easy to see that this same guy might, behind the scenes, rescue a Wookie or do good deeds when he thought no-one was looking. Money became his goal - so he worked for the highest bidder because, in a galaxy that no longer enshrined scruples on the part of the individual in any way at all, survival and looking after one's self was the only sensible option. he had a rep to keep up - and the last thing he wanted was to be known as a good guy, a soft touch, so he was probably harder than anyone else when backed into a corner. 

How Han met Chewie is going to be an important part of this story.  And yes, I see a lot of the above in young Han.  It would be sort of like a good person trying to be bad.  No matter what, he knows right from wrong, and there would be lines he wouldn't cross.  He will never do anything that would be irredeemable.

He's someone that does what he has to do to survive but there are lines he won't cross, even if it endangers him.  Maybe that's how he got in trouble with Jabba in the first place.

A good person would make a bad criminal.

 

And even in ANH, just because Han didn't join up like Luke did right away didn't make him a bad person.  Here's the reality of it--if a major powerful bad guy had a price on your head, wouldn't your first concern be to pay him off?  I actually disagree with Leia because Han had every right to get paid.  It was contracted and he NEEDED the money for his LIFE.  Once he had his freedom, then the choices he made are truly his own.  The fact that he came back ANYWAY even reinforces the notion that he was never all that bad.  That's why I liken him to Quark a bit--again, not a clone or anything close to that, but when Quark did bad things, they weren't all that bad, and he never did anything to make the audience dislike him.

 

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And even in ANH, just because Han didn't join up like Luke did right away didn't make him a bad person.  Here's the reality of it--if a major powerful bad guy had a price on your head, wouldn't your first concern be to pay him off?  I actually disagree with Leia because Han had every right to get paid.  It was contracted and he NEEDED the money for his LIFE.  Once he had his freedom, then the choices he made are truly his own.  The fact that he came back ANYWAY even reinforces the notion that he was never all that bad.  That's why I liken him to Quark a bit--again, not a clone or anything close to that, but when Quark did bad things, they weren't all that bad, and he never did anything to make the audience dislike him

Yeah, but it was the timing.

There was an Imperial battle station with the ability to blow up a planet bearing down on the Rebellion and Han chose THAT moment to pay off Jabba instead of helping out one last time?  And that was AFTER the rebels paid him off, too; you'd think he would've just said, 'what the hell' and joined the attack.

It was his seeming lack of concern for the fate of his newfound allies that made him seem callous and selfish in SW77.

And to answer your query, no; paying off debts wouldn't be my top priority if I were in Han's position.   If the rebels gave me the reward (as they did) and were facing immediate extinction?  I would throw in my lot with them once more.   And if I survived?  Then I would worry about paying off Jabba.   An extra hour or so wouldn't make all that much difference.

After the Death Star was destroyed (if it were destroyed), then yes; my first priority would be the get the hell out of Dodge and pay off my debt.   If the Death Star wasn't destroyed?  I'd be dead anyway.   Oh well.  Tough luck, Jabba.  But only when I was debt-free would I consider re-upping with the rebellion.  

And you're right, sticking around with the rebels while Han had a bounty on his head wasn't a good idea (as "that bounty hunter on Ord Mandell" and the later incident with Boba Fett proved).    

But when the rebels were facing imminent destruction from the Death Star?   Han could afford to (and did) take the time to help out one last time.   That's why he was a hero and not the ruthless ship/gun-for-hire he seemed to be in the Mos Eisley cantina.

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Han's life was directly on the line.  He had EVERY right to deal with what he had to deal with.  Leia even gave him crap in Empire when he wanted to go.  That wasn't Han's fight at that point, and he was used to taking care of himself.  But notice, he DID change his mind and help out.

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Han Solo is officially recast:

Alden Ehrenreich is the new Han Solo/Deadline.com

hansolo2by2.jpg?w=446&h=299&crop=1

They could've done worse... though I still prefer my original pic, Anthony Ingruber, the actor who played a younger Harrison Ford in "Age of Adeline" (2015):

684500f9ce55caf078f47a9fd65c5bda695500a9

 

Just saying...

tumblr_nq0thoW5wq1r2ckpzo1_500.gif

 

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Yes, Sehlat, actor Alden Ehrenreich is Confirmed To Play Young HAN SOLO; May Debut In ROGUE ONE
Though the news has yet to be confirmed by the trades, reports are coming in that the Hail, Caesar! actor has indeed secured the role of the young Han Solo in the upcoming Star Wars spinoff................Maybe its a good choice, I dunno.

Gus

Edited by GustavoLeao

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Very excited to hear that the movie will chronicle Han's first encounter with Chewbacca.   I've heard several non-canon versions of how this took place (my favorite being that Han was in the Imperial navy and sprung Chewie from a brutal interrogation... much the way Finn rescued Poe in TFA).    Now we'll get a definitive onscreen answer to that one (of course, if I don't like the new version?  I'll stick with my head-canon version... :P ). 

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Very excited to hear that the movie will chronicle Han's first encounter with Chewbacca.   I've heard several non-canon versions of how this took place (my favorite being that Han was in the Imperial navy and sprung Chewie from a brutal interrogation... much the way Finn rescued Poe in TFA).    Now we'll get a definitive onscreen answer to that one (of course, if I don't like the new version?  I'll stick with my head-canon version... :P ). 

C'est simple!

C'est la vie!

:thumbup:

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Very excited to hear that the movie will chronicle Han's first encounter with Chewbacca.   I've heard several non-canon versions of how this took place (my favorite being that Han was in the Imperial navy and sprung Chewie from a brutal interrogation... much the way Finn rescued Poe in TFA).    Now we'll get a definitive onscreen answer to that one (of course, if I don't like the new version?  I'll stick with my head-canon version... :P ). 

C'est simple!

C'est la vie!

:thumbup:

That's Sehlat Vie... :P :giggle:

* runs & hides... * 

But bad puns aside (ba-dum-tsss!), I think if they stuck to the Han-springs-Chewie-from-Imperial-interrogation version, it'd resonate a lot more with TFA.   It may also explain why Han really "like(d) this guy" when he spoke of Finn; he may have saw a little something of himself in the kid (the better part of himself). 

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 The HAN SOLO Screenplay Has Been Described As The Best One In The STAR WARS Series To Date

A concept artist for the Star Wars movies has made a pretty bold statement about Phil Lord and Chris Miller's Han Solo movie which should help you forget any reservations you have about it.

If that quote came from an outsider who'd read the script, it'd have a bit more merit; but not from a guy whose bread and butter is Star Wars.   That's a bit like an employee of a store telling you that HIS store's tomatoes are the freshest. ;)

That said?  I look forward to the movie, but not because of an insider endorsement... 

 

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There's some footage here from the recent SWCE introducing Alden Ehrenreich, the actor cast as the new Han Solo. It's about halfway through, 11.35 or so if you want to skip the directors' Q&A - which is nothing terribly enlightening, pretty standard SW effusion. They seemed likeable enough. Watching Ehrenreich is interesting though - he comes across as quite shy and considered, and highly conscious of what he's undertaking. I haven't seen him act, so I've nothing to base my impressions upon apart from this panel clip, but he comes across as very likeable and intelligent. Dunno whether that means I'll be able to buy him as Solo, but its evident just from his appearance here that he also has a palpable charisma, which of course he's really gonna need.

http://makingstarwars.net/2016/07/video-han-solo-a-star-wars-story-panel-highlights/

 

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There's some footage here from the recent SWCE introducing Alden Ehrenreich, the actor cast as the new Han Solo. It's about halfway through, 11.35 or so if you want to skip the directors' Q&A - which is nothing terribly enlightening, pretty standard SW effusion. They seemed likeable enough. Watching Ehrenreich is interesting though - he comes across as quite shy and considered, and highly conscious of what he's undertaking. I haven't seen him act, so I've nothing to base my impressions upon apart from this panel clip, but he comes across as very likeable and intelligent. Dunno whether that means I'll be able to buy him as Solo, but its evident just from his appearance here that he also has a palpable charisma, which of course he's really gonna need.

http://makingstarwars.net/2016/07/video-han-solo-a-star-wars-story-panel-highlights/

 

It'd be interesting if Han Solo of the prequel hasn't yet fully evolved into the cool, swaggering space cowboy we first see in SW77.   More Peter Quill/Starlord than fully evolved Han Solo...

We see glimpses of a slightly more bumbling Solo now and then in the OT (his "what?" face when the hyperdrive fails, the snapping twig in ROTJ, etc); it'd be interesting if that were more like his true self. 

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There's some footage here from the recent SWCE introducing Alden Ehrenreich, the actor cast as the new Han Solo. It's about halfway through, 11.35 or so if you want to skip the directors' Q&A - which is nothing terribly enlightening, pretty standard SW effusion. They seemed likeable enough. Watching Ehrenreich is interesting though - he comes across as quite shy and considered, and highly conscious of what he's undertaking. I haven't seen him act, so I've nothing to base my impressions upon apart from this panel clip, but he comes across as very likeable and intelligent. Dunno whether that means I'll be able to buy him as Solo, but its evident just from his appearance here that he also has a palpable charisma, which of course he's really gonna need.

http://makingstarwars.net/2016/07/video-han-solo-a-star-wars-story-panel-highlights/

 

It'd be interesting if Han Solo of the prequel hasn't yet fully evolved into the cool, swaggering space cowboy we first see in SW77.   More Peter Quill/Starlord than fully evolved Han Solo...

We see glimpses of a slightly more bumbling Solo now and then in the OT (his "what?" face when the hyperdrive fails, the snapping twig in ROTJ, etc); it'd be interesting if that were more like his true self. 

I'm thinking... hoping... we can be reasonably sure Kasdan isn't going to do the straightforward thing here and just deliver an "Early Han Solo adventure." I'm hoping it's more like what you suggest - that he subverts expectations.

I don't know how the hell you'd do that, but if anyone can, he can.

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There's some footage here from the recent SWCE introducing Alden Ehrenreich, the actor cast as the new Han Solo. It's about halfway through, 11.35 or so if you want to skip the directors' Q&A - which is nothing terribly enlightening, pretty standard SW effusion. They seemed likeable enough. Watching Ehrenreich is interesting though - he comes across as quite shy and considered, and highly conscious of what he's undertaking. I haven't seen him act, so I've nothing to base my impressions upon apart from this panel clip, but he comes across as very likeable and intelligent. Dunno whether that means I'll be able to buy him as Solo, but its evident just from his appearance here that he also has a palpable charisma, which of course he's really gonna need.

http://makingstarwars.net/2016/07/video-han-solo-a-star-wars-story-panel-highlights/

 

It'd be interesting if Han Solo of the prequel hasn't yet fully evolved into the cool, swaggering space cowboy we first see in SW77.   More Peter Quill/Starlord than fully evolved Han Solo...

We see glimpses of a slightly more bumbling Solo now and then in the OT (his "what?" face when the hyperdrive fails, the snapping twig in ROTJ, etc); it'd be interesting if that were more like his true self. 

I'm thinking... hoping... we can be reasonably sure Kasdan isn't going to do the straightforward thing here and just deliver an "Early Han Solo adventure." I'm hoping it's more like what you suggest - that he subverts expectations.

I don't know how the hell you'd do that, but if anyone can, he can.

Leads cheer:

Kas-dan, Kas-dan, he's our man; if he can't do it?  No one can! :thumbup:

 

He certainly did a hell of a job with adding extra Star Wars-ness to Force Awakens.

 

 

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There's some footage here from the recent SWCE introducing Alden Ehrenreich, the actor cast as the new Han Solo. It's about halfway through, 11.35 or so if you want to skip the directors' Q&A - which is nothing terribly enlightening, pretty standard SW effusion. They seemed likeable enough. Watching Ehrenreich is interesting though - he comes across as quite shy and considered, and highly conscious of what he's undertaking. I haven't seen him act, so I've nothing to base my impressions upon apart from this panel clip, but he comes across as very likeable and intelligent. Dunno whether that means I'll be able to buy him as Solo, but its evident just from his appearance here that he also has a palpable charisma, which of course he's really gonna need.

http://makingstarwars.net/2016/07/video-han-solo-a-star-wars-story-panel-highlights/

 

It'd be interesting if Han Solo of the prequel hasn't yet fully evolved into the cool, swaggering space cowboy we first see in SW77.   More Peter Quill/Starlord than fully evolved Han Solo...

We see glimpses of a slightly more bumbling Solo now and then in the OT (his "what?" face when the hyperdrive fails, the snapping twig in ROTJ, etc); it'd be interesting if that were more like his true self. 

I'm thinking... hoping... we can be reasonably sure Kasdan isn't going to do the straightforward thing here and just deliver an "Early Han Solo adventure." I'm hoping it's more like what you suggest - that he subverts expectations.

I don't know how the hell you'd do that, but if anyone can, he can.

Leads cheer:

Kas-dan, Kas-dan, he's our man; if he can't do it?  No one can! :thumbup:

 

He certainly did a hell of a job with adding extra Star Wars-ness to Force Awakens.

 

 

Zees is what ah is theenking. :biggrin:

Kas-dan, Kas-dan, you're Obi-Wan and we're your fanz! 

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Here's the official version from the SW Show - More "thrilled, amazing"-style soundbites than the panel, but thought worth posting:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JGCR89WQ87g

 

Glad Thrawn is canon now, but I'd still love to see him in live-action someday.

And 'space monkey' reminds me a bit of Rocket from "Guardians of the Galaxy." :thumbup:

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Here's the official version from the SW Show - More "thrilled, amazing"-style soundbites than the panel, but thought worth posting:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JGCR89WQ87g

 

Glad Thrawn is canon now, but I'd still love to see him in live-action someday.

And 'space monkey' reminds me a bit of Rocket from "Guardians of the Galaxy." :thumbup:

Zahn's Thrawn novels were the last EU books, I read really, and the only ones I honestly rated - they were fun reads, a cut above the usual tie-in stuff mostly because Thrawn himself was such a weird, offbeat character for the SW universe - and he totally worked. It's definitely a good development.

Er, sorry. Han Solo. He's good, isn't he? the ones Brian Daley did featuring Han are the only other SW novels I really remember - not details, but as good times. he got the character right, as I recall.

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Here's the official version from the SW Show - More "thrilled, amazing"-style soundbites than the panel, but thought worth posting:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JGCR89WQ87g

 

Glad Thrawn is canon now, but I'd still love to see him in live-action someday.

And 'space monkey' reminds me a bit of Rocket from "Guardians of the Galaxy." :thumbup:

Zahn's Thrawn novels were the last EU books, I read really, and the only ones I honestly rated - they were fun reads, a cut above the usual tie-in stuff mostly because Thrawn himself was such a weird, offbeat character for the SW universe - and he totally worked. It's definitely a good development.

Er, sorry. Han Solo. He's good, isn't he? the ones Brian Daley did featuring Han are the only other SW novels I really remember - not details, but as good times. he got the character right, as I recall.

The only one of Daley's I remember was "Han Solo At Star's End" which was a decent read (when I was 12, of course... and hungry for any and all things SW).  

The late Brian Daley (1947-96) also adapted SW77 and TESB into radio plays for National Public Radio (sadly, he passed away before he could work on the adatation for ROTJ, which was not quite as good as the previous two).

If you ever want to hear nicely detailed, 'taking-their-time' adaptations of the original movies?  You should give these a listen.   Fills in lots of missing scenes and adds a few new scenes that fit really well into the tone of the first two movies.   Mark Hamill and Anthony Daniels reprise their roles in the first two, but only Daniels returns for ROTJ.    Billy Dee Williams also does Lando for TESB adaptation (but not for ROTJ).  

Even if his SW novels weren't all that and a bag of chips, I will always revere him for his amazing NPR SW radio plays... the first two were gold! 

You can download them from Amazon, I believe.  

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