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richpit

Supergirl?

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Tonight's episode was rescheduled and replaced with the episode that was supposed to follow it.  Apparently, the episode had Kara flying around stopping bombs in the city, and they felt it was too close to what happened in Paris.

I sort of get that, but if the majority of the audience is in the States, I don't think that people are so emotionally hurting that they can't distinguish fiction and reality. 

I didn't watch the ep last night but I had to jump into the conversation based on this comment. I'm glad that you sort of get that. The rest of your comment surprises me since it implies a lack of empathy with what's happening in the world. I suppose it would be fine if you lived isolated in Middle Earth or something like that. And indeed you may be. Maybe you don't. I lived in WV for a decade and many people there were very disconnected with what was happening around them from town to town, out of state was a foreign trip, and another country might as well be Romulus. Very rural and isolated society. But to suggest that the 'majority' in the US wouldn't care is a leap since we've seen many people take to social outlets to discuss recent happenings. People are talking about it at work and at home. 

I don't have to know someone from Kenya to feel horrified by the massacre in April. I don't have to visit France to care about that nation. I don't have any Russian friends either. We can blame the media for not knowing. We can blame society. In the end it's us to blame. If Paris hadn't happened, not many of us including myself, would have known about the Kenya and the Beirut attack which happened just the day before Paris. 

Then consider, how many more lives this affected than just the people in those countries.So yes, I somewhat agree with you. Some Americans may not care but it's clear to me many others are reacting to these terrible events. It was smart to move the eps around. Would it had made a difference if they aired that ep instead? You bet. The media campaign that would build up against the show would be huge. You know we love to complain!

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If Superman is going to get a cameo, I highly doubt it will be Cavill doing the part.  It would be very interesting though, because that would establish or at least imply that this show is in the movie universe, and Benoist could play the role there. 

Supergirl's universe doesn't seem to gel with the Cavill Superman's universe.  It'd be an awkward fit....

They will be crazy whether this episode aired or not.  Anyone who is inclined to blow up a building isn't going to be put over the edge by an episode of Supergirl.

The deference wasn't so much for the potential bombers as much as for the ones who fear that they could be the victim. People are already on edge. There's no reason to show them the boom.

 Is Flockhart really that big of a deal?  She was the star of a show over 10 years ago and hasn't done all that much since.

Name recognition. And she has fans. And that's what she could get. Cuba Gooding Jr. still makes $1-$2.5M per film and he peaked 20 years ago.

 

^
She's also Mrs. Harrison Ford.   Pretty sure she has clout.  And according to IMDB, she had several series after Ally McBeal.
And that's a good point about Cuba Gooding Jr.; hard to believe he went from "Boys in the Hood" to "Boat Trip" (
sweet baby Jeezus...).

Also a good point about not further fanning the flames by airing the episode.   Whether it inspires nutbags, or simply hurts the already afflicted, it's a good idea to let things simmer down a bit.   No one's hurt by the decision, and the good karma/PR is beneficial overall.

Tonight's episode was rescheduled and replaced with the episode that was supposed to follow it.  Apparently, the episode had Kara flying around stopping bombs in the city, and they felt it was too close to what happened in Paris.

I sort of get that, but if the majority of the audience is in the States, I don't think that people are so emotionally hurting that they can't distinguish fiction and reality. 

I didn't watch the ep last night but I had to jump into the conversation based on this comment. I'm glad that you sort of get that. The rest of your comment surprises me since it implies a lack of empathy with what's happening in the world. I suppose it would be fine if you lived isolated in Middle Earth or something like that. And indeed you may be. Maybe you don't. I lived in WV for a decade and many people there were very disconnected with what was happening around them from town to town, out of state was a foreign trip, and another country might as well be Romulus. Very rural and isolated society. But to suggest that the 'majority' in the US wouldn't care is a leap since we've seen many people take to social outlets to discuss recent happenings. People are talking about it at work and at home. 

I don't have to know someone from Kenya to feel horrified by the massacre in April. I don't have to visit France to care about that nation. I don't have any Russian friends either. We can blame the media for not knowing. We can blame society. In the end it's us to blame. If Paris hadn't happened, not many of us including myself, would have known about the Kenya and the Beirut attack which happened just the day before Paris. 

Then consider, how many more lives this affected than just the people in those countries.So yes, I somewhat agree with you. Some Americans may not care but it's clear to me many others are reacting to these terrible events. It was smart to move the eps around. Would it had made a difference if they aired that ep instead? You bet. The media campaign that would build up against the show would be huge. You know we love to complain!

Without getting too KM here, I'd just like to say that we live in an ever-increasingly global culture.   It's wise to be both empathic and sensitive to the needs of the world whenever possible.  Hell, I'd say a heaping dose of empathy everywhere would make this world a better place.

As Spock says in TOS' Immunity Syndrome "(Suffering thy neighbor) might have made (Earth) history a little less bloody..." 

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Supergirl's universe doesn't seem to gel with the Cavill Superman's universe.  It'd be an awkward fit....

Watch that and then MoS or the BvS trailers. The tone is completely different. They don't take place in the same universe.

She's also Mrs. Harrison Ford.   Pretty sure she has clout.  And according to IMDB, she had several series after Ally McBeal.
And that's a good point about Cuba Gooding Jr.; hard to believe he went from "Boys in the Hood" to "Boat Trip" (sweet baby Jeezus...).

 No doubt that helps keep people on his good side when they might want to work with an acting legend. As for Gooding. I wonder how much of it was bad choices on his part and how much it was just Hollywood done with the man of the moment, It's a lot of the same trajectory as Eddie Murphy.

As Spock says in TOS' Immunity Syndrome "(Suffering thy neighbor) might have made (Earth) history a little less bloody..." 

Oceans less, I think. 

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I'm not saying people don't CARE about the events. 

Even if they don't affect you personally, and are far away, you can't not react in some fashion.  I think you misread my point, which is fine.  It may not have been written well by me.  I'm just saying that it's only natural that something in your own backyard will affect you more.  And I don't think there is enough people that are so emotionally tied to these events that it was necessary to postpone an episode of Supergirl.  Not that the events aren't horrifying.  They are.  Being a NYer, I get what they are going through.  I've been there at an even larger scale.  But even after 9/11, I can say that nothing Supergirl aired would bother me, even if it aired on 9/12.  I think almost every person on the planet can distinguish between a fantasy TV show and real world horrible events. 

I'm saying that an episode of Supergirl isn't going to sway anyone's opinion on anything.  If you are reacting strongly to the attacks, Supergirl isn't going to make it worse.  You're already there.  And if you are the type that doesn't care, you're not going to appreciate or sympathize more because Kara is stopping bombs on TV.

If you are a paranoid nutjob, Supergirl isn't going to inspire you to commit violence--you are already there.  The point is that while I get the gesture, and I understand the thought behind it, rearranging the episode order of Supergirl doesn't do much other than make the schedulers feel good about themselves.

 

Supergirl's universe doesn't seem to gel with the Cavill Superman's universe.  It'd be an awkward fit....

I think you're right.  The tones are different.  What stinks is I think Supergirl's tone is far closer to what is right for the DCCU.

She's also Mrs. Harrison Ford.   Pretty sure she has clout.  And according to IMDB, she had several series after Ally McBeal.
And that's a good point about Cuba Gooding Jr.; hard to believe he went from "Boys in the Hood" to "Boat Trip" (
sweet baby Jeezus...).

I think if Supergirl wanted to move money toward effects and guest stars, then losing Flockhart wouldn't kill the show.  Her character is not supposed to be bad, but she's not very likable, and while she isn't as mean on the inside and we know this, I think the show wouldn't be devastated without her.

No one's hurt by the decision, and the good karma/PR is beneficial overall.

I think this is the most realistic thing.  Ultimately, I doubt the show is hurt that badly by the decision if at all.  This didn't generate bad press at all, and rightfully so.  This isn't some sort of PC response or something ridiculous.  It was a decision that while I may not agree with it, I understand it, but I think the only real benefit is decent PR. 

Maybe it helped.  The ratings were higher this week.

 

 

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A tenth point is just publicity about the change and isn't that much to crow about anyway.

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But even after 9/11, I can say that nothing Supergirl aired would bother me, even if it aired on 9/12.  I think almost every person on the planet can distinguish between a fantasy TV show and real world horrible events. 

It's not that people can't distinguish reality from fantasy; it's that the fantasy is an all-too vivid reminder of the reality.   Even if your personal sensibilities aren't offended, there are the needs of the many to consider.   The same way you wouldn't play "I Shot the Sheriff" by Eric Clapton at a policeman's funeral.  It's just insensitive.  I'm not saying that it would influence anyone to take action, and I think that's the incorrect assumption to take from it.   It's just bad timing.   

They made the right call.   With the world so globally connected these days?  Paris might as well be just over the Hudson river... 

I think this is the most realistic thing.  Ultimately, I doubt the show is hurt that badly by the decision if at all.  This didn't generate bad press at all, and rightfully so.  This isn't some sort of PC response or something ridiculous.  It was a decision that while I may not agree with it, I understand it, but I think the only real benefit is decent PR. 

Maybe it helped.  The ratings were higher this week.

Like I said, good PR = good karma. ;) 

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Flockhart was on the ABC series Brothers and Sisters for it's run of 5-6 years. It would be fun if she could talk Ford into taking some kind of role but she's never been in anything he's done either, so maybe they want to keep their work lives separate (plus, Ford has only done tv once I've ever seen so maybe his people would scream if he considered such a thing). 

Had they not had Kara on Smallville, I would have no problem with them bringing in Tom Welling to finally be seen in the Superman suit. As it is, having Brandon Routh appear would be the only one to make sense in terms of some continuity, But with him on Arrow and soon another show playing another superhero might complicate that.

I still think it's cool Slater and Cain are the parents.

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Tom Welling would have been a fun idea, though I agree, Smallville can't be connected.  And yes, Routh is now the Atom, so that doesn't work either.  I believe that Supergirl should be connected in some capacity to Flash and Arrow, and I'm actually hoping that the show does NOT take place on Earth 2.  I want it on Earth 1.

I think if they do have Superman appear, it needs to be an entirely new actor who never played the role before. 

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Flockhart was on the ABC series Brothers and Sisters for it's run of 5-6 years. It would be fun if she could talk Ford into taking some kind of role but she's never been in anything he's done either, so maybe they want to keep their work lives separate (plus, Ford has only done tv once I've ever seen so maybe his people would scream if he considered such a thing). 

Had they not had Kara on Smallville, I would have no problem with them bringing in Tom Welling to finally be seen in the Superman suit. As it is, having Brandon Routh appear would be the only one to make sense in terms of some continuity, But with him on Arrow and soon another show playing another superhero might complicate that.

I still think it's cool Slater and Cain are the parents.

Supergirl feels very much in line with Routh's Superman universe; and Routh never got a fair shake in the role anyway (he was good; the movie was so-so).  

That said?  I still think it's too early to show full-on Superman.  If they have to do it (and I don't think they should), it should be the season 2 finale.  The stakes are really high; Kara has just had the challenge of her lifetime.   All seems lost, Kara is physically taxed and at the end of her rope.  We see a quick shot of Routh in full Superman regalia silhouetted in a doorway, with "to be continued..." on the screen.  

That's the way I'd do it.   And even then it'd be like McCoy in TNG; a nice, memorable cameo but it ends there.  You don't see Admiral McCoy turn up in "Unification" or "Relics."  You know he's out there, but that's it.   Otherwise it becomes "McCoy and the New Kids on the Block."   

A Supergirl show with Superman dropping by every week would be Supercousins, not Supergirl. 

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Probably more for the other DC thread, but Routh may not have had a good script, but his Superman was a super wimp.  The Superman described on this show, feels more like the way I hope Superman would be portrayed, and that wasn't Routh's version.

Plus, Ray Palmer's resemblance to Superman would probably give the good scientist a lot of grief, and it would have been mentioned on Arrow.

I can understand not having Superman on the show every week.  For a Supergirl show, that makes sense.  Even close relatives don't see each other and hang out every day as adults.  I might have Superman be a finale/opener/sweeps character.  Cameos most of the time, and one episode a year where he does something significant. 

Kara having him as a mentor is not a bad thing and wouldn't have him taking over the show. 

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Kara having him as a mentor is not a bad thing and wouldn't have him taking over the show. 

Ahhh....but that's the issue right there. Superman does take over the whole show. Look at how much we've devoted to talking about him rather than her. He is so much of a developed character that he overshadows her even when not present. Even on the show. 

They really should have come up with some plot device not to have Superman present and that's the reason that Kara comes out of the super closet. 

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Ahhh....but that's the issue right there. Superman does take over the whole show. Look at how much we've devoted to talking about him rather than her. He is so much of a developed character that he overshadows her even when not present. Even on the show. 

This.

Kara is so bland and uninspired (while being admittedly perky) we're looking for anything else to talk about in a show titled "Supergirl" 

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Of course Superman will be talked about--he exists in the universe, and doesn't appear.  That's a major part.  Supergirl has always been his supporting character.  But one of the things about TV is that the tables can be reversed.

Makes me want to read some Supergirl comics to see how they handled the relationship.  I'm guessing he appeared once in awhile, and did not take things over.

I think if you ignore Superman, it would have been far worse--people would be talking about Superman's return.  Plus, Supergirl's relationship to Superman is a major part of who she is.  She can be her own person, but she wears those colors for a reason. 

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Of course Superman will be talked about--he exists in the universe, and doesn't appear.  That's a major part.  Supergirl has always been his supporting character.  But one of the things about TV is that the tables can be reversed.

Problem is with the show called "Supergirl" is that it really hasn't been reversed. The show spends far too much time talking about him. That, coupled with her general ineptitude, leaves the audience with the sense that they have to "settle" for Kara. 

I think if you ignore Superman, it would have been far worse--people would be talking about Superman's return.  Plus, Supergirl's relationship to Superman is a major part of who she is.  She can be her own person, but she wears those colors for a reason. 

Sure, they'd wonder if he'd appear, but they'd be left judging Kara on her own merits, but that's not the case. And he's only a big part of her life because she spends psychologically abnormal amounts of time living in his shadow by her own choice. 

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Kara having him as a mentor is not a bad thing and wouldn't have him taking over the show. 

Ahhh....but that's the issue right there. Superman does take over the whole show. Look at how much we've devoted to talking about him rather than her. He is so much of a developed character that he overshadows her even when not present. Even on the show. 

They really should have come up with some plot device not to have Superman present and that's the reason that Kara comes out of the super closet. 

Agreed, on both points.

And you're absolutely right.  If you make Superman Kara's mentor, then she's automatically reduced to being a student... on her own damn show!  What's the point?  Might as well retitle it "The New Adventures of Superman (oh, and his sidekick/cousin, Kara too...)."  Superman needs to be out of the picture as much as possible.  Maybe the Doomsday/Death of Superman plot could happen offscreen in Metropolis and Superman could be dead (at least for awhile)?   It would also hammer home the point that Kara is now the ONLY super-act in town...

However it could've been done, I just wish that Superman wouldn't be so 'available' so that Kara would HAVE to had stood on her own in the first season.  But now, that's water under the bridge, because they've already used the Superman panic button.   Thanks a lot, Jimmy...

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However it could've been done, I just wish that Superman wouldn't be so 'available' so that Kara would HAVE to had stood on her own in the first season.  But now, that's water under the bridge, because they've already used the Superman panic button.   Thanks a lot, Jimmy...

I love that watch. Flip up the top and that big, red S.

So much for anonymity. 

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Kara having him as a mentor is not a bad thing and wouldn't have him taking over the show. 

Ahhh....but that's the issue right there. Superman does take over the whole show. Look at how much we've devoted to talking about him rather than her. He is so much of a developed character that he overshadows her even when not present. Even on the show. 

They really should have come up with some plot device not to have Superman present and that's the reason that Kara comes out of the super closet. 

Agreed, on both points.

And you're absolutely right.  If you make Superman Kara's mentor, then she's automatically reduced to being a student... on her own damn show!  What's the point?  Might as well retitle it "The New Adventures of Superman (oh, and his sidekick/cousin, Kara too...)."  Superman needs to be out of the picture as much as possible.  Maybe the Doomsday/Death of Superman plot could happen offscreen in Metropolis and Superman could be dead (at least for awhile)?   It would also hammer home the point that Kara is now the ONLY super-act in town...

However it could've been done, I just wish that Superman wouldn't be so 'available' so that Kara would HAVE to had stood on her own in the first season.  But now, that's water under the bridge, because they've already used the Superman panic button.   Thanks a lot, Jimmy...

Ahem....you mean 'James'. You know, more mature, grown up, whatever. 

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Kara having him as a mentor is not a bad thing and wouldn't have him taking over the show. 

Ahhh....but that's the issue right there. Superman does take over the whole show. Look at how much we've devoted to talking about him rather than her. He is so much of a developed character that he overshadows her even when not present. Even on the show. 

They really should have come up with some plot device not to have Superman present and that's the reason that Kara comes out of the super closet. 

Agreed, on both points.

And you're absolutely right.  If you make Superman Kara's mentor, then she's automatically reduced to being a student... on her own damn show!  What's the point?  Might as well retitle it "The New Adventures of Superman (oh, and his sidekick/cousin, Kara too...)."  Superman needs to be out of the picture as much as possible.  Maybe the Doomsday/Death of Superman plot could happen offscreen in Metropolis and Superman could be dead (at least for awhile)?   It would also hammer home the point that Kara is now the ONLY super-act in town...

However it could've been done, I just wish that Superman wouldn't be so 'available' so that Kara would HAVE to had stood on her own in the first season.  But now, that's water under the bridge, because they've already used the Superman panic button.   Thanks a lot, Jimmy...

Ahem....you mean 'James'. You know, more mature, grown up, whatever. 

You mean the former geeky Daily Planet staff photographer who suddenly looks like he walked out from the pages of Playgirl?  Ah yes, James...

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Being a student on her own show isn't a bad thing--when she is in fact, a student.  She needs a mentor anyway, and is getting that role fulfilled by Superman via text, Jimmy, her friends, etc.

She's a novice superhero, and there's nothing wrong with that.  Likewise, the idea that Superman would help her is also quite normal within that universe.

The Doomsday/Death of Superman plot would be interesting, though it's very hard to do that story without a little more from Superman himself.  It's actually a very interesting idea because you have a major Superman story told from the point of view of Supergirl. 

But it would be very hard to convey the impact of that story without more Justice League members, and the story would NECESSARILY end with Superman's return.

I think to do that right, there needs to be a big team up story with the two of them first.  Superman would need to be cast.  That's actually important because Hank Henshaw is a major part of that story.  The story would also have to be toned down. 

Superman would have to be cast just to have the four Supermen aspect of the story.  It would also be a great way to turn Henshaw into a villain, but at that point, the actor would have to be recast and played by the same actor who plays Superman. 

This could be an arc that takes up half a season, if not all of it.  All these major Superman events, but through Kara's eyes and perspective.  She would be going through grief, and the need to step up in his shadow.  Plus, the guilt she would feel by not joining the fight.

It's an interesting idea.

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Being a student on her own show isn't a bad thing--when she is in fact, a student.  She needs a mentor anyway, and is getting that role fulfilled by Superman via text, Jimmy, her friends, etc.

She's a novice superhero, and there's nothing wrong with that.  Likewise, the idea that Superman would help her is also quite normal within that universe.

The Doomsday/Death of Superman plot would be interesting, though it's very hard to do that story without a little more from Superman himself.  It's actually a very interesting idea because you have a major Superman story told from the point of view of Supergirl. 

But it would be very hard to convey the impact of that story without more Justice League members, and the story would NECESSARILY end with Superman's return.

I think to do that right, there needs to be a big team up story with the two of them first.  Superman would need to be cast.  That's actually important because Hank Henshaw is a major part of that story.  The story would also have to be toned down. 

Superman would have to be cast just to have the four Supermen aspect of the story.  It would also be a great way to turn Henshaw into a villain, but at that point, the actor would have to be recast and played by the same actor who plays Superman. 

This could be an arc that takes up half a season, if not all of it.  All these major Superman events, but through Kara's eyes and perspective.  She would be going through grief, and the need to step up in his shadow.  Plus, the guilt she would feel by not joining the fight.

It's an interesting idea.

She doesn't need mentors; she needs partners.

And Olsen is being set up as her love interest, not her teacher.   As for Superman?  Bad idea, and too soon.  That's all I can say. 

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Contrary to their belief, 20 somethings do not have the experience necessary to be an expert on what they do from day one.  There's a learning curve, and everyone needs mentors in any field, be it police work, medicine, law, or superheroing from another planet.

So yes, she does need a mentor, and Ally McBeal isn't it.

 

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Contrary to their belief, 20 somethings do not have the experience necessary to be an expert on what they do from day one.  There's a learning curve, and everyone needs mentors in any field, be it police work, medicine, law, or superheroing from another planet.

So yes, she does need a mentor, and Ally McBeal isn't it.

 

Then she's not all that Super.

And she's decidedly immature on top of that, particularly given this calling that she's always claimed to have.

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Well, in the SUPERGIRL TV series Jimmy Olsen is black and male. In the MAN OF STELL movie, Olsen was white and FEMALE. I dont think its the same universe, its one of the 52 paralllels universes as established in THE FLASH TV series.

Gus

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What makes Supergirl super is that she is someone with nearly unlimited power and she's dedicated to doing good.

That doesn't mean she naturally knows what to do.

Perfect example was the second episode when she tried to take on a task that she wasn't ready to do.  A superhero needs to not only stop the bad guy, but limit the collateral damage.

I don't think she's immature at all.  I think she's inexperienced.  No one comes out of the gate an expert in their job, and age has nothing to do with that.

As for a love interest, they are bringing in Benoist's real life husband.

I'm curious what role he will play.  In the comics, Supergirl had a thing with Brainiac 5, who is from the Legion of Superheroes, 1000 years in the future.  If they go that route, it would actually be kind of awesome.

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