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Who lost the most crew under their command?

Favorite Overall Trek Series/Movie  

206 members have voted

  1. 1. What is your overall favorite Star Trek series?

    • Star Trek: Enterprise
      16
    • Star Trek: The Original Series
      51
    • Star Trek: The Animated Series
      0
    • Star Trek: The Next Generation
      55
    • Star Trek: Deep Space Nine
      50
    • Star Trek: Voyager
      34
  2. 2. What is your overall favorite Star Trek movie?

    • Star Trek - I: The Motion Picture
      10
    • Star Trek - II: The Wrath of Khan
      41
    • Star Trek - III: The Search for Spock
      7
    • Star Trek - IV: The Voyage Home
      22
    • Star Trek - V: The Final Frontier
      4
    • Star Trek - VI: The Undiscovered Country
      29
    • Star Trek - VII: Generations
      11
    • Star Trek - VIII: First Contact
      64
    • Star Trek - IX: Insurrection
      7
    • Star Trek - X: Nemesis
      11


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Even IF we decided to count Wolf 359 (I'm with Sehlat on this one, though, nope we don't)... Locutus didn't command any of the Starfleet vessels. He wasn't in charge of the fleet. The original question isn't 'which captain caused most deaths' (and even then I wouldn't count these 11,000) - it's 'who lost the most people under their COMMAND'.

So, actually, the only even vaguely possible 'lost under his command' ones we should be counting in this case are the Borg drones aboard the Cube. They were the ones Locutus commanded. (And who commanded him.) Locutus DESTROYED the Wolf 359 fleet but he didn't COMMAND it.

Not that I think Jean-Luc should be blamed for anything at Wolf 359. LOCUTUS was the one who did things. Those people who blamed Jean-Luc for what happened were just looking for a scapegoat. I understand their bitterness but they should direct it at the BORG, not Jean-Luc. I'm sure they would reconsider QUITE quickly if THEY were assimilated. How about THAT. See what it's like... let them lie there helplessly while their humanity is taken from them piece by piece... and THEN I'd love to hear more about how 'Picard is to blame for Wolf 359'...

Locutus's role and presence in Wolf 359 is pretty well irrelevant. All he did was stand and watch the carnage play out on the viewscreen. The Borg didn't need him there beyond him opening hailing frequencies and try and convince the fleet to stand down. The real damage there was done days ago by the Borg when they essentially mind-raped Picard for his tactical knowledge the moment the assimilation process began. Even if Picard was already fighting back before the battle the Borg already had what they needed to win.

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Even IF we decided to count Wolf 359 (I'm with Sehlat on this one, though, nope we don't)... Locutus didn't command any of the Starfleet vessels. He wasn't in charge of the fleet. The original question isn't 'which captain caused most deaths' (and even then I wouldn't count these 11,000) - it's 'who lost the most people under their COMMAND'.

So, actually, the only even vaguely possible 'lost under his command' ones we should be counting in this case are the Borg drones aboard the Cube. They were the ones Locutus commanded. (And who commanded him.) Locutus DESTROYED the Wolf 359 fleet but he didn't COMMAND it.

Not that I think Jean-Luc should be blamed for anything at Wolf 359. LOCUTUS was the one who did things. Those people who blamed Jean-Luc for what happened were just looking for a scapegoat. I understand their bitterness but they should direct it at the BORG, not Jean-Luc. I'm sure they would reconsider QUITE quickly if THEY were assimilated. How about THAT. See what it's like... let them lie there helplessly while their humanity is taken from them piece by piece... and THEN I'd love to hear more about how 'Picard is to blame for Wolf 359'...

Locutus's role and presence in Wolf 359 is pretty well irrelevant. All he did was stand and watch the carnage play out on the viewscreen. The Borg didn't need him there beyond him opening hailing frequencies and try and convince the fleet to stand down. The real damage there was done days ago by the Borg when they essentially mind-raped Picard for his tactical knowledge the moment the assimilation process began. Even if Picard was already fighting back before the battle the Borg already had what they needed to win.

Yet another reason for not blaming Jean-Luc for anything that happened at Wolf 359. IMO.

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janeway would had lost most of her crew in caretaker.

Didn't she also lose a few in "Basics Part 2"?

I haven't watched since its initial broadcast so I could be wrong...

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janeway would had lost most of her crew in caretaker.

Didn't she also lose a few in "Basics Part 2"?

I haven't watched since its initial broadcast so I could be wrong...

Hogan dies in the cave while collecting bones to be used as tools or weapons. Neelix asked him to go in, but Janeway was in command but not present when the attack happens iirc. Suder dies as well trying to liberate the ship. The irony being of course that he had just learned to control those urges with meditation, and here the Doctor is encouraging him to go on another killing spree. I wish they had kept his character... I don't think anyone else dies in that episode, although the natives kidnap Neelix and Kes and try to offer one of their own girls + Neelix's release as compensation for Kes.

Don't we also have to take into account the number of seasons? Maybe divide it and make it a rate of (red shirt deaths/episodes).

Okay I've found some good links:

http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Starfleet_casualties_(22nd_century)

http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Starfleet_casualties_(23rd_century)

http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Starfleet_casualties_(24th_century)

Edited by Hammer

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I voted Ben Sisko, because of the Klingon Incursions, and Dominion Incursions/war. He was in command of entire battle fleets.

BUt as for incompotence, I say Janeway takes the cake. Followed by Pine Kirk. Followed by Shat Kirk, Followed by Jean Luc Picard.

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When I saw this question I was surprised no one came up with a link to statistics immediately. Well here is an interesting link I didn't see posted:

KIRK

http://www.sitelogicmarketing.com/analytics-according-to-captain-kirk/

in all of his glory... had

  • Yellow-shirt crewperson deaths: 6 (10%)
  • Blue-Shirt crewperson deaths: 5 (8 %)
  • Engineering smock crewperson deaths: 4
  • Red-Shirt crewperson deaths: 43 (73%)
  • There were 130 fights over 80 episodes.

So by illusion I think Kirk seems like the most deadly of captains if only perhaps during his rein of television there were so many fights and deaths compared to the sheer number of episodes. If you do a ratio comparison it just kind of strikes you that a day with Janeway or Picard, you might find yourself more likely to be investigating something safe than if you were with Kirk and happened to be wearing red. (Well red, back in the day.) Not that they are safer, or Kirk actually caused more havoc, though according to the Temporal Investigations, he wreaked the most havoc with time travel.

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