Voyager

That Which Survives

Favorite Overall Trek Series/Movie   197 members have voted

  1. 1. What is your overall favorite Star Trek series?

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      16
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      28
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14 posts in this topic

That Which Survives

TOS Season 3, Episode 17

TELEPLAY BY

John Meredyth Lucas

STORY BY

Michael Richards

DIRECTED BY

Herb Wallerstein

First Aired Jan 24, 1969

Stardate Unknown

Captain Kirk, Dr. McCoy and Sulu are trapped on an unexplored planet with a woman who has looks that could kill and a touch that certainly does, while the Enterprise screams through space on a warp factor to destruction.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I'm not really interested in what is happening on the planet, but Spock is priceless this episode, so I give it a 7.

"The occipital area of my head seems to have impacted with the arm of the chair. :thumbup:

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What I like about this episode is that it features Sulu on the planet instead of Spock. (Don't get me wrong, I love Spock, but Kirk-Spock-Bones is usually the landing party choice and it's nice to see someone else there instead.)

It gets a 7 from me as well.

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A decent ep with good screen time for Sulu....Lee Meriwether guest stars as the sensual Losira.

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Watchable, but not IMO one of the greats. Loved Spock's comebacks though, he had more lines here than I think in any other 3 episodes put together. I must say that I'd go insane with such a pedantic commanding officer though!

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A terrifically silly episode, in some ways pure Season 3. I found myself bored by it halfway and faintly amused unintentionally: the whole "I want to touch you!" Easy missus, Jim Kirk gets a lot of hell for that. Spock was amusing, ion the good way and there's the fact we have a female helmsman as well.

Bit of a waste of Lee Merriwether

5

Edited by Mackenzie Calhoun

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This wasn't very good, really. Why was the engineer explaining to an alien intruder and possible threat what those consoles were? I did really like Sulu in this one, I don't know what it was, but some of the stuff he said just tickled my funny bone. This gets a 4.

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I like this episode a lot, giving it at least a 7.  Even though many people don't care for season 3, S3 happens to have a number of really good episodes, and "That Which Survives" is among them IMO. 

Yes, it was nice to see Sulu in this episode.  Our helmsman doesn't always have the best luck as a landing party member, however.  He nearly freezes to death in "The Enemy Within" and gets turned into a waxwork figure in "The Squire of Gothos".  In this episode he nearly buys the farm (or perhaps the sushi restaurant?) when Losira touches him.  I also really liked senior geologist D'Amato.  A pity his character got killed off, but it just proves that it isn't always red shirts who bite the dust in TOS.  Also nice to see the second appearance of Dr. M'Benga, and any chance to see Scotty in action makes an episode entirely worth watching, of course!   He lets his excitable nature show a few times, but once again he saves the ship's bacon.  Our hero! 

As to the actions of engineering assistant Watkins, what he should have done was call out to Scotty immediately letting him know there was an intruder in their section.  When Losira asked him to explain how the matter/anti-matter bypass valve works (or whatever it was), to his credit he did at least deliberately lie to her.   Losira obviously knew exactly what the equipment was and how it functioned but used the question and her non-threatening appearance to buy the time she needed to get Watkins out of the way, allowing her to sabotage the Enterprise.  He may not have been wearing a red shirt, but apparently a red jumpsuit was just as unlucky! :ohmy:

Here is one thing I don't understand.  Normally, all members of a landing party are equipped with communicators, phasers, and at least one or two tricorders.  Kirk's phaser overloads and explodes, presumably leaving two other working phasers.  At the end when Kirk, McCoy and Sulu are faced with three Losira's closing in on them, why didn't McCoy or Sulu simply whip out one of the remaining phasers and fire at the computer? A deer-in-the-headlights moment for our landing party, perhaps?  It was sheer luck that Spock and the other crewman beamed down at that exact moment in time to destroy it.  Ah well..... Still a great episode!

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Have to admit, I love this episode, too. The German dubbing makes it even better. :laugh:

IMO, it's pure trash, perhaps #2 right behind "Spock's Brain"... which makes it much more (unintentionally) hilarious, memorable, entertaining and rewatchable than some "better", but mediocre episodes. It's perhaps also perfectly suited to watch with buddies when you're drunk.

I love TOS, warts and all, and this episode is no exception: It's so bad it's even good.

 

The guys who made the German dubbing apparently didn't manage to take this episode seriously either, so they added even more silly jokes than usual:

After Spock hit his head and Uhura asks him if he's okay, he says: "Hope nothing will remain." Uhura: "What do you mean?" Spock: "The occipital area of my head got in hard contact with the chair." Uhura: "Can't you express yourself more popularly?" Spock: "Yeah, I hit my bean at the brim." :laugh:

Or:

Scotty: "If they're just gone like that, I gonna eat a broom that's been standing in syrup for five years!" Spock: "You're lickerish, Mr. Scott, but seriously..."

Or Kirk in the end:

"What do you know about women, Spock? You old sex grump!" :giggle::thumbup: <--- the most perfect K/S moment in the German dubbing!

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I like this one too.

Total semi-guilty pleasure. :P

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The guys who made the German dubbing apparently didn't manage to take this episode seriously either, so they added even more silly jokes than usual:

After Spock hit his head and Uhura asks him if he's okay, he says: "Hope nothing will remain." Uhura: "What do you mean?" Spock: "The occipital area of my head got in hard contact with the chair." Uhura: "Can't you express yourself more popularly?" Spock: "Yeah, I hit my bean at the brim." :laugh:

Or:

Scotty: "If they're just gone like that, I gonna eat a broom that's been standing in syrup for five years!" Spock: "You're lickerish, Mr. Scott, but seriously..."

Or Kirk in the end:

"What do you know about women, Spock? You old sex grump!" :giggle::thumbup: <--- the most perfect K/S moment in the German dubbing!

You're kidding!  Wow, that's amazing! :laugh:  I guess there's no quality control over the dubbing, no oversight by the people who own Trek to make sure that it's done right or anything?  Fascinating.

The thing I like best about this episode is the way Losira turns sideways, becomes a line, and then the line squishes down into a point; that was a really cool special effect for 1969!

But the idea that "beauty survives" is even more hokey and strange than the third-season average; I have to wonder if there was supposed to be some other ending that they didn't have time to film or something...

I thought both Kirk and Spock were out of character in this episode; they seemed like caricatures of themselves, rather than their real selves.  A woman who calls herself Plaid Adder has reviews of all the TOS episodes on Archive of Our Own, and in her review of this one she says, "I don’t know what Shatner and Nimoy did to piss Lucas (and perhaps Fontana) off, but both Kirk and Spock act like dicks in this episode. Kirk shuts down Sulu’s first attempt to be helpful by comparing the earthquake to the impact of a meteor that hit Siberia back in the day: “Mr. Sulu, if I’d wanted a Russian history lesson I’d have brought along Mr. Chekov.” (Yeah…where IS that guy, anyway?) Kirk does eventually ease up on him, but it’s hard to see why he’s so pissed off, and Sulu doesn’t seem to quite know how to respond to it.

Spock, meanwhile, is a parody of himself. There’s no other way to put it. He is forced to make himself the butt of jokes about his Vulcanness nearly every time he opens his mouth. Instead of the snarky Spock who knows what the humans want from him but just isn’t interested in providing it, we have a naïve and terminally square Spock who never gets a joke or recognizes a figure of speech."  So I'm not the only one who thought the guys were wildly out of character here.

Still, the idea that all of the inhabitants of a planet had died, but their automatic defense systems were still defending them was poignant and creepy, which wasn't bad for third-season TOS.

 

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The guys who made the German dubbing apparently didn't manage to take this episode seriously either, so they added even more silly jokes than usual:

After Spock hit his head and Uhura asks him if he's okay, he says: "Hope nothing will remain." Uhura: "What do you mean?" Spock: "The occipital area of my head got in hard contact with the chair." Uhura: "Can't you express yourself more popularly?" Spock: "Yeah, I hit my bean at the brim." :laugh:

Or:

Scotty: "If they're just gone like that, I gonna eat a broom that's been standing in syrup for five years!" Spock: "You're lickerish, Mr. Scott, but seriously..."

Or Kirk in the end:

"What do you know about women, Spock? You old sex grump!" :giggle::thumbup: <--- the most perfect K/S moment in the German dubbing!

You're kidding!  Wow, that's amazing! :laugh:  I guess there's no quality control over the dubbing, no oversight by the people who own Trek to make sure that it's done right or anything?  Fascinating.

Yes... at least there wasn't in 1972. The dubbing of most other episodes is much less silly, though, especially those which were dubbed later (the 40 episodes dubbed in 1987 or "Patterns of Force" in 1995 -- those translations are mostly close to the original).

I had the strong impression the dubbing guys really just had a very hard time taking this particular episode seriously. :laugh:

The thing I like best about this episode is the way Losira turns sideways, becomes a line, and then the line squishes down into a point; that was a really cool special effect for 1969!

When I first saw it when I was 10, I too felt it was a pretty creepy special effect (especially with the added music).

But the idea that "beauty survives" is even more hokey and strange than the third-season average; I have to wonder if there was supposed to be some other ending that they didn't have time to film or something...

I thought both Kirk and Spock were out of character in this episode; they seemed like caricatures of themselves, rather than their real selves.  A woman who calls herself Plaid Adder has reviews of all the TOS episodes on Archive of Our Own, and in her review of this one she says, "I don’t know what Shatner and Nimoy did to piss Lucas (and perhaps Fontana) off, but both Kirk and Spock act like dicks in this episode. Kirk shuts down Sulu’s first attempt to be helpful by comparing the earthquake to the impact of a meteor that hit Siberia back in the day: “Mr. Sulu, if I’d wanted a Russian history lesson I’d have brought along Mr. Chekov.” (Yeah…where IS that guy, anyway?) Kirk does eventually ease up on him, but it’s hard to see why he’s so pissed off, and Sulu doesn’t seem to quite know how to respond to it.

In the German version: Kirk: "We aren't on earth, so it can't be an earthquake, right?" :giggle:

Spock, meanwhile, is a parody of himself. There’s no other way to put it. He is forced to make himself the butt of jokes about his Vulcanness nearly every time he opens his mouth. Instead of the snarky Spock who knows what the humans want from him but just isn’t interested in providing it, we have a naïve and terminally square Spock who never gets a joke or recognizes a figure of speech."  So I'm not the only one who thought the guys were wildly out of character here.

Still, the idea that all of the inhabitants of a planet had died, but their automatic defense systems were still defending them was poignant and creepy, which wasn't bad for third-season TOS.

 

Yeah, good observations. But then, I enjoy the episode for its trash factor, much like "Spock's Brain". It's so bad, it's even good. :thumbup:

Edited by Sim

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The guys who made the German dubbing apparently didn't manage to take this episode seriously either, so they added even more silly jokes than usual:

After Spock hit his head and Uhura asks him if he's okay, he says: "Hope nothing will remain." Uhura: "What do you mean?" Spock: "The occipital area of my head got in hard contact with the chair." Uhura: "Can't you express yourself more popularly?" Spock: "Yeah, I hit my bean at the brim." :laugh:

Or:

Scotty: "If they're just gone like that, I gonna eat a broom that's been standing in syrup for five years!" Spock: "You're lickerish, Mr. Scott, but seriously..."

Or Kirk in the end:

"What do you know about women, Spock? You old sex grump!" :giggle::thumbup: <--- the most perfect K/S moment in the German dubbing!

You're kidding!  Wow, that's amazing! :laugh:  I guess there's no quality control over the dubbing, no oversight by the people who own Trek to make sure that it's done right or anything?  Fascinating.

The thing I like best about this episode is the way Losira turns sideways, becomes a line, and then the line squishes down into a point; that was a really cool special effect for 1969!

But the idea that "beauty survives" is even more hokey and strange than the third-season average; I have to wonder if there was supposed to be some other ending that they didn't have time to film or something...

I thought both Kirk and Spock were out of character in this episode; they seemed like caricatures of themselves, rather than their real selves.  A woman who calls herself Plaid Adder has reviews of all the TOS episodes on Archive of Our Own, and in her review of this one she says, "I don’t know what Shatner and Nimoy did to piss Lucas (and perhaps Fontana) off, but both Kirk and Spock act like dicks in this episode. Kirk shuts down Sulu’s first attempt to be helpful by comparing the earthquake to the impact of a meteor that hit Siberia back in the day: “Mr. Sulu, if I’d wanted a Russian history lesson I’d have brought along Mr. Chekov.” (Yeah…where IS that guy, anyway?) Kirk does eventually ease up on him, but it’s hard to see why he’s so pissed off, and Sulu doesn’t seem to quite know how to respond to it.

Spock, meanwhile, is a parody of himself. There’s no other way to put it. He is forced to make himself the butt of jokes about his Vulcanness nearly every time he opens his mouth. Instead of the snarky Spock who knows what the humans want from him but just isn’t interested in providing it, we have a naïve and terminally square Spock who never gets a joke or recognizes a figure of speech."  So I'm not the only one who thought the guys were wildly out of character here.

Still, the idea that all of the inhabitants of a planet had died, but their automatic defense systems were still defending them was poignant and creepy, which wasn't bad for third-season TOS.

 

Yes, Losira turning into a thin line and squishing down to a point (as well as the spooky music) was a very cool, memorable and creative special effect for TOS! Speaking of special effects, I'm a huge fan of "The Lights of Zetar", and I have to smile whenever I read comments on how creeped out people are or were (especially as kids) to see the faces of the Reidonian technician and Mira contorting and changing colors as the Zetars attacked them.  Really? That never phased me in the least, even as a kid.  What I hated were the incredibly ugly, garbled sounds they made!    

In my previous comment on this episode I mentioned that engineer Watkins should have called out to Scotty immediately to alert him of the intruder in their area, but what good would it have done?  If phasers couldn't stop her, there was certainly nothing Scotty or anyone else could have done (although they didn't know that). She might, however, have disappeared faster had Watkins called out sooner.  What is weird is how quickly she managed to sabotage the m/am bypass valve after Watkins called out to Scotty, because Scotty was immediately running towards him, and the deed was already done.  If she can work that quickly, one wonders why she didn't just dispense with Watkins at the outset.  As stated previously, she knew exactly what the equipment was and how it worked, so her conversation with him was entirely superfluous.

Kirk's comment that "beauty survives" seems odd and incredibly superficial.  Losira was indeed a beautiful woman (bizarre eye makeup notwithstanding), but the fact that her replica had the power to hurl the Enterprise such a huge distance and sabotage it so quickly and expertly speaks volumes on how incredibly advanced her lost civilization was, as Spock points out.  Kirk's sexist comments like "Are you l-o-n-e-l-y?" and "You better tell us" are simply ridiculous by comparison.  Uh, captain....she better tell you or what?  Perhaps the episode should have had a title more in line with all that Losira represented. 

 

 

 

 

 

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